What was Arma banned for? I noticed that he started acting like he was superior to us because he was French and acted like this board was American and he was above us.
That was the reason he was banned though, right?
What was Arma banned for? I noticed that he started acting like he was superior to us because he was French and acted like this board was American and he was above us.
That was the reason he was banned though, right?
Just speculation, but he had only 14 posts and more than half of them could have been considered trolling. He just wasn't a contributing member.
In The Beginning...
He isn't banned, he just can't post and the reason is because he was being an arse hole. Nobody has the right to come here and start acting the way he did. I warned him but he still continued with his smart arse answers.Originally Posted by Mr. Casual
Yakumo
TWITTER @RetroCoreYakumo
The comments I made relating to allowing a conversation (thread) , debate or call it what you will was not in my opinion "hating on the other mods" it was merely an observation that previous controversial threads had been locked up and shut down pretty quickly and in some instances (again in my humble opinion) for spurious reasons.
You can't win of course! As soon as you get 2 or 3 posters on any forum you'll start getting differences of opinion. I just feel that on this occassion despite the direction the thread was heading, and apparently complaints being sent to staff, that they took the more mature / wiser decision to allow the 'debate' to burn out.
Wikipedia states that "A contribution is on-topic if it is within the bounds of the current discussion and off-topic if not" and I happen to have felt that as the thread was entitled "Virginia Tech shooting - at least 32 dead" and Taemos posting included the following text "I want to know exactly how people get so fucked in the head that they think killing 30+ innocent people is a good idea" that my contribution was on-topic.
It was suggested I had thrown the thread off-topic and lowered the tone, yet the thread never seemed in my opinion to be a book of condolences if you will. Taemos used the term "fucked in the head" in his very first posting and the thread title mentioned shooting. Although I hate to be critical of the owner (as he could kick me off this gig) he actually posted "you can't protect yourself from a madman'' prior to my posting. It is not a giant leap from his posting to mine, but I made the cardinal sin of bringing into question gun laws, which might (or might not) be at the back of this horrific crime.
It does seem on the face-of-it that to question anything remotely dear to the American population is quickly deemed "Anti-American" and I am genuinely shocked that such a label was swiftly plastered on me for holding views about American law. Whilst at University I studied UK / European politics (as a side subject, not my main) and for a laugh I read a lot of American history (as DeadPerfect and he will vouch for my families historical credentials and interest).
In reality I feel that I didn't deliberately post anything offensive, but my comments managed to offend a small group of posters who became rather vocal about my stance & opinion. Those comments were not just ill advised or unpopular, they were rounded on and suddenly the thread was a mess!
The only difference that I can see is that my opinions are based on historical facts and not gun ownership and I think if the majority of those who were enflamed by my words are going to be honest they took my words to mean I was criticising ALL gun owners in the US, of which there are MILLIONS!
In light of Assemblers contribution a few postings back I can see there really is an entirely different mindset at work here. The ownership of a gun as a duty in order to protect oneself is an ALIEN concept far removed from anything I have encountered previously and I can see that pro-gun enthusiasts are very vocal and rally against those who appear to be anti-gun lobby.
I walked into a bear pit! Despite my proximity to the American way of life, this is something akin to a baptism of fire!
If you are a gun owner and you are a reasonable, sane, intelligent human being who genuinely believes that owning a gun is your right (nae, duty) then you are going to witness the masacre in Virginia Tech and immediately think "oh fuck, here we go..." and expect high profile criticism and debate relating to whether you should be allowed to maintain that duty of gun ownership.
Sadly, it does only take the irresponsible & thoughtless actions of one to put into the public forum whether this should be maintained or not.
My opinions are irrelevant, I am a citizen of the UK and have NO say in what occurs in the United States.
I keep going round & round on this and promise this is the last posting I make on the subject unless someone asks a specific question, but I think in this instance it is best that I stop posting and just agree to disagree. My words have been misrepresented as I merely meant to imply that once again lax gun laws may (and it appears that new reports prove me at least partially correct here) have put firearms into the possession of someone who was knowingly unfit to uphold the 'duty' of safely baring arms.
That was in a nutshell the gist of my postings. At NO time did I ever say "all guns are wrong, they should be banned, all gun owners are a threat, they are all potential nut jobs ready to spring into action". I was implying (I thought clearly) that gun laws (anywhere) that are unsound can potentially (and clearly do) lead to weaponry being available to those unfit to take their responsibility seriously. The US gun death figures are a startling reminder to any gun owner anywhere that tighter controls are a necessary evil in ensuring that violent crimes are ''reduced'' (I never said eliminated - I am realistic''. Just HOW my words were offensive still baffles me, but I accept that they may have been misunderstood and as such I apologised.
Again, I am not calling American gun owners psychopathic gun nuts! I am however saying that lax gun laws ANYWHERE can (and do) lead to unnecessary violent crimes.
I am also saying, I am glad Paulo let the thread run because I don't feel that certain comments, considering how the thread was titled and how the thread began were necessarily off-topic. It is in my opinion that mods have the last say however, it is after all their (and Assemblers) duty to ensure that threads remain amicable and polite.
Apologise all the way, and having said that, can I go now? I wish to discuss more pressing issues, such as my PS2 Tool failing to boot.
Thanks to everyone for their contributions, pro or anti or otherwise! It has been a very interesting lesson. :clap:
You will probably be unaware of this, but a few years ago there was a petrol shortage in the UK. What stunned everyone (including the politicians) was how quickly the country ground to a halt. Within 12 days stocks were so low that people were urged to abandon their cars for public transport or walk to work. Shops were empty as stock couldn't be delivered and power generation was reduced to peak hours.
12 days...
Given your arguement (and I am NOT about to start again) the reason for gun ownership is to ensure that when / if America is thrown into civil unrest that you are able to protect yourself & your property from looters, other gunmen and the unseen X who may or may not have kick started this revolution, right?
What is the population of the United States again? How many bullets and arms are you going to need when / if it kicks off?
Considering Americas recent (and violent) civil wars it might be of interest for you to read "March" by Geraldine Brooks (an American / Australian author). It's a novel, basically a love story wrapped around a very historically accurate depiction of civil war in the US. Not normally my type of book (before the laughter starts!) but a relative passed it on and I was struck by the accuracy & descriptions.
If you have already read it, you should also read (re-read) "Lord of the flies" by William Golding relating to how quickly the order of society can breakdown and how seemingly innocent, civilised and educated children can and will revert to type under certain conditions. It's one of those English lit books you endure at school, but when you read it later in life you think "holy crap, this is excellent". If I ever get marooned on a desert island I would ensure I had a copy of it with me just as a reminder - plus obviously a few DHL packages with things like footballs for company etc ;-)
I've managed to dodge 2 gun men in my 35 yrs of life and I doubt I'd be so lucky on my 3rd attempt, so I try to avoid them as much as I can ;-)
Last edited by Parris; 04-19-2007 at 05:43 AM.
Hey Parris where did these run ins with gun toting criminals occur? I don't doubt you. I'm just curious as I live in a country where there is a right to bare arms and have never once been assaulted, yet presuming these occurences took place in the UK where gun control is so strict, that's kind of weird...
And no I'm not implying that this is proof that the US is better or anything. It's just one person among millions comparing his story to another among millions.
In The Beginning...
You crafty fox you! ;-)
The first incident was in France where gun ownership among the countryside is high as they are all fans of "La Chasse" (the hunt) as someone previously pointed out, they also love fresh (or not so fresh sometimes) game. France has strict gun laws and a low accident / murder rate regarding guns.
The incident took place in the Alps when I was in my teens. A young kid managed to find where his mother stupidly held her gun UNLOCKED. He removed the gun and took it outside into the street. Next I know the neighbouring woman is going ape and shouting "PUT THAT DOWN" she then called on me (why me ffs!) and asked me to try and get the gun off the kid.
As it turns out he had NO idea it was real, the mother was a total idiot and should never have been allowed a gun in the first place, which is my point entirely (unsafe gun ownership, deminished responsibility meets an error in gun application = accident waiting to happen).
I coaxed him into putting the gun down as he pretended to shoot me. For a split second I thought he was going to do it. How ironic, to be shot dead by a 9 year old kid.
The Police were never called (French Police are armed and locals seldom trust them) and we ended up calming a very distraught child who had genuinely thought it was a toy. The mother was clearly concerned for the welfare of her son, but seemed to calmly accept that he might have shot me dead. So much for gun control a la France!
Second time was in the UK (ya, got me!!!) and the gunman held up a local store. Until recently I was not able to say anything about it as my wife and I were witnesses, but the case was dropped by the Police. Apparently, because of the mental aptitude of the guman at the time (and the fact that he was paralysed in the process) they saw no reason to proceed.
He was almost the same age as me, about 32 / 33 at the time and he was drunk. God alone knows where he obtained the gun from, but the saddest part of all of this is that nobody has ever confirmed whether the gun was real or not. He stole a packet of cigarettes, a bottle of vodka and threatened the guy behind the counter at point blank range. To the shop keepers amazement, as the guy was a regular! He was in so much shock that he carried on serving other customers for about 5mins afterwards before collapsing from shock. He later said he just went blank.
Rather than pack his pistolo and go, the guy then decided to HIDE outside one of the largest stadium in the UK, which was at the time directly across the road from our house. He was in plain view and a stadium has a massive carpark around it, so he was visible. He stood and smoked the cigarettes, drank the vodka and the street cleared as he threatened two teenagers with the gun, waving it in their faces and telling them to "F off home".
He was still there about 20mins later, swaying when I made the mistake of looking out my window. There he was, staring directly at me with the gun in his hand. He pointed it at me and I dropped to the floor like a stone. he actually started coming towards the house and I gathered up the kids and wife and got them into the back of the house, switched all the lights off, kept low down and ran to warn all the neighbours. He must have been distracted as he then wandered off to the local bar (who had locked their doors seeing him on CCTV). They were holding a wedding function and if he had tried, he could have shot his way in... That is something that still keeps coming back to me as he tried to kick the door in and I could see the guy on the other side of the glass holding the door shut.
Anyway, I dodged the guy, got back into the house and started to call people I knew who'd be coming home from work and possibly coming down the street. I need not have bothered as when I looked out the window the Police armed response team arrived in vans, jumped out, shouted a few warnings. The gunman raised his arm and swung it towards the Police and before he could do anything he was shot through the upper body.
Apparently the bullet severed his spine and he is now left paralysed in hospital. The whole thing to me is needless, tragic and stupid.
I know the shop keeper and he had to quit because of the stress. He's have happily handed over vodka and cigarettes to anyone who came in if they were strapped for cash. He'd have asked for it later. We sometimes used to go in for milk or various smaller items late at night and pay for them on our way to work the next day.
The young gunman almost lost his life for no apparent reason and has lost his mobility for a moments madness.
Gun laws in the UK are incredibly strict and they are even considering banning air pistols after some arsehole shot a baby through the eye a couple of years ago. Luckily incidents of this sort are still considered shocking as they are still relatively rare.
Strict gun laws cannot irradicate violent gun crimes. They can however make very strong in-roads to curb such events and the message to the public is also very strong. Anyone who is seen brandishing a gun in public (or even on their own property) is subject to an immediate SWAT team sting. Clearly county estates, farms and the like have less scrutiny as guns are seen as part of the job, but that has a double edged sword (mixing metaphores here folks) as the suicide rate amongst farmers in the UK is incredibly high partly due to the ease of obtaining a gun and also due to the controlled, poisonous substances available to them for farm work.
Again, having been asked I am replying. I never suggested strict gun laws will end violent crime. Guns ARE available on the black market. The difference is that the majority of people (unlike in America where gun ownership seems to be an accepted norm) would never consider owning a gun.
If you take statistics in the UK into account then gunshot injuries, accidents AND homicides have been reduced year on year since 1995. In the UK there are 360,000 legally owned certificated firearms in the hands of just 146,000 people, but a whopping 1,400,000 shotguns owned by up to 620,000 people in the UK. Compare that to 80million gun owners (known of) in the USA (population just short of 300million), which means almost 1/4 of you guys are armed in contrast only 1/10 of us Brits are. Big gun culture difference I think you'll agree.
Compare that to the statistics relating to deaths, injuries and homicides in the UK and USA and you find that in a 100,000 control group the USA vastly outstrips the number of accidental deaths, suicides and homicides committed.
Country Homicide Suicide Accident
USA 4.08 6.08 0.42
Canada 0.54 2.65 0.15
Switzerland 0.50 5.78 N/A
England 0.12 0.22 0.01
Scotland 0.24 1.34 0.09
** Epidemiology: Deaths from firearms are a reflection of their availability in various countries. The above table gives figures per 100,000 population and are derived from the WHO3 and the Australian Institute of Criminology4:
<Not that any of this is funny, but please note Switzerland had NO accidents caused by guns! This is incredible or surely no stats were collated for this?>
Over 60million people live in the UK, of which 84% of whom like in England, so it could be argued that Scotland has a higher rate of gun deaths. The USA still manages to top all tables.
Now I am not saying it is PURELY gun laws. It is also GUN CULTURE. If you make a gun available, it can and invariably will be used illegally. With 200million guns in US circulation (potentially a great deal more) and 30,000 deaths attributed directly to gun crime then MY arguement is that clearly it is not a LONE shooter type of situation. Guns are definately falling into the wrong hands illegally & legally obtained. Stricter controls have always ensured reduced access to people who wish to obtain weapons for illegal purposes. Even something as having to show legal ownership of a licensed firearm and sufficient ID to obtain bullets would reduce fatalities. We don't have supermarkets that sell bullets, for example. The gun is useless when unloaded. The worst that can happen is someone has a heart attack or SWAT kill someone brandishing an unloaded weapon.
Even if this were to be proven incorrect, I would like to point out that it is always necessary to debate the flaws in public & administrative perceptions and realise where issues stem from rather than out right denounce comments either for or against.
My thoughts are that the United States would do well to reconsider gun laws, keep tighter controls on those who are able to obtain the guns legally (because the arguement that illegal guns exist in the US is a moot point, considering almost anyone can obtain a gun for whatever purpose) as well as most other democratic societies in the world.
32 college students dying is but a mere drop in the ocean of 30,000 per annum and even then it is a massive body blow to the system. It is tragic. Could you really stand 1,000 such incidents per annum occuring? If every campus across the US were subject to the same type of incident, would you not expect, no DEMAND of your politicians to establish the root of the issue and protect your population from such attacks?
I do not pretend to have all the answers to a sad state of affairs but I am positive that more guns in more hands is not the answer.
See, I get drawn into these conversations because I actually genuinely care!!! Stop it! lol:DOH:
Last edited by Parris; 04-19-2007 at 02:14 PM.
As I type these long responses I feel my life ebbing away and my credibility as a poster being tested lol - stop, stop, stop!!!! You all know how I feel, that's enough now....no enough thanks, enough! Stop! :noooo:
Jesus Christ mate, are you trying to break my scroll wheel? I did actually read it, and I'm with you all the way, anyway. Sorry to hear about your experiences with guns, but I guess both incidents could've been a lot worse.
LOL - FAO Assembler, can I have that as the little tag under my name please "Scroll wheel breaker!"
I think on this note I should bow out of any future discussions on this matter. It has been good to hear all the comments, whether in agreement or not.
<leaves stage left, never to return...> :thumbsup:
after reading most of the posts, I have concluded that only women should be allowed to bear arms.
You never/rarely hear a woman shooting random people.
men and guns don't mix -size, machoness, and the big ego kick-in and everyone else has to pay for it :(
You can ask for any old woman
You can ask for an army of ants
You can ask for a pillar of poison
You can ask for sheep and shavers
And you can die for
Be careful what you wish for
No, women are like the Swiss it seems...they discharge their weapon but it was NO accident!
<Note to self, you said you were NOT going to reply!!><
Last edited by Parris; 04-19-2007 at 02:36 PM.
it's ok Parris, it wasn't you replying, it was the ghost that lives in the TOOL and stops it from functioning :lol:
You can ask for any old woman
You can ask for an army of ants
You can ask for a pillar of poison
You can ask for sheep and shavers
And you can die for
Be careful what you wish for
Yeah, I really do need to go into the attic and grab my tool, if you pardon the unfortunate phrase & imagery contained therein. ;-) It's long over due that I return to the world of consoles after months of banal DIY. Bloody property! Sucks you dry and spits you out, then when you die they hit your relatives for the tax!
Last edited by Parris; 04-19-2007 at 02:45 PM.
*off topic* Only had a Nintendo Wii for 36 hours, and I've already managed to take out a lamp and pull a muscle..............but damm im good at wii tennis
BSCCOC, People Against Clubman Exploitation
Be Strange. Be Odd. Just BEAN.
RGGG smells
Last edited by Mark30001; 04-22-2007 at 11:58 AM.
...GOOD!:lol:
both of you can't appreciate the fine aroma of ass........
BSCCOC, People Against Clubman Exploitation
Be Strange. Be Odd. Just BEAN.
(checks thread...leaves fast)
LOL - Wise man! :clap:
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