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Thread: Blown ntsc Sega Saturn mod 2 power board. Advice needed

  1. #21
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    There are two voltage pins on a SCART, one is the channel auto switch, and one is RGB Select. The auto switch is indeed unnecessary, but if the RGB select pin is not hooked up, your tv set will only use composite signal.

    The Saturn Scart RGB cable (the official PAL one anyway) has that +9v line hooked up to both pins. If there is no +9v line in the console, the Scart cable will only output composite, since the RGB select pin will have no signal (unless your TV can manually select between rgb and composite input from a Scart cable, which is theoretically not impossible but I don't know how common it is). If you use a 110v power supply on a VA6+ saturn, you won't provide any power to the 9v pin, the RGB Select pin on the Scart will remain empty, and your display will not switch to RGB mode. This is a moot point though since the only NTSC power supplies you can use with PAL machines are the ones that have an empty hole for the fifth pin, and not all of them have that, so chances are the thing won't physically fit unless you cut off the fifth power connector pin. Plus, why the hell would you want to run a PAL machine in a 110v country anyway.

    I've had saturns that had the +9v line burnt out (short circuit blew an inductor near the av output), and they did not display RGB, only composite, unless I used my own-made cable that used the +5v pin for RGB select.

    NTSC Saturn scart cables are all third party (*), and most vendors on ebay have separate ntsc and ntsc+c-sync (raw sync) cables available. Those ntsc cables should work on a PAL Saturn, as long as you are not using the "raw sync" ones, which can instead damage your tv or the saturn or both (by feeding +9v dc to the composite input of your tv).

    (*) the one exception is the japanese RGB21 cable which is like Scart but with a different pinout, and I don't know if it uses composite or c-sync.
    Last edited by Druid II; 08-15-2012 at 03:02 AM.

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  2. #22
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    Linking 9v to the RGB select line is incorrect. Its 1-3v for RGB select.

    Do you have a link to the pinout (and any resistors used) in the offical cable? As that sounds very wrong.

    I am pretty sure the cables I have has pin 8 (5v) linked to both pins (with a resistor between the RGB select to bring it down to 3v).

    This is why they do not work properly on modern (widescreen tvs) and switch back and forth between widescreen (5v-9v) and 4:3 (well actually, its just dipping below 5v which is technically off, but as you have already changed the channel to scart input, its 4:3). Before Widescreen TV's were around, this wasnt an issue as the only mode was 4:3. I just ended up disconnecting the auto switch pin and manually change the channel.
    Last edited by Bad_Ad84; 08-15-2012 at 03:31 AM.
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  3. #23
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    The official cable has the +9v line sent to pins 8 and 16 of the Scart plug, with a 275ohm resistor inbetween the two pins. Everything else is as-is. It works fine on both my plasma and my old no-brand CRT (it does not change into widescreen mode on the plasma).

    Also, note that some PAL model 2 power supplies have a 12v line on the fifth pin.
    Last edited by Druid II; 08-15-2012 at 11:08 AM.

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  4. #24
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    widescreen/4:3 switching wouldnt occur with 9v - so that very much backs up what you are saying.

    However all those scart cables (including one that my friend says came with his model 1 saturn) that we thought were official - all have 5v rather than 9v as the source to those pins.
    Quote Originally Posted by APE View Post
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  5. #25
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    I'm holding an official cable right here, the one with the bigger scart case that is closed by a screw, and the +5v pin is not even there on the connector. In fact, I've yet to find any Scart cables that used +5v, other than third party or home made ones.

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  6. #26
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    Well you remember in that other thread we talked about official scart leads and the ones without the screws - those have 5v and my friends console has that same cable, which he swears came with his model 1 at launch.
    Quote Originally Posted by APE View Post
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  7. #27
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    If you mean those very high quality cables with thick shielding, ferrite beads, and shrink tubing inside the Scart plug, I have three of those and all of them use 9v. Well, except one I had to mutilate because it had contact errors.

    The Scart plug I used for my Saturn way back in 1998 was also like that, and while I couldn't have known what pins it used, I'm sure it was an official cable. I think they had two types of cables in circulation. Maybe one manufacturer used one type of cable, and another one used another type?

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  8. #28
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    Not sure, but they are definitely 5v on the one I have (which does the widescreen switching thing). The one my friend has also does the widescreen thing and the cable looks identical (yes, the ferrite bead ones with good shielding)

    I will get his cable just to confirm, as this is quite weird. As I said before - I cant be certain my ones are official (came with console bundles), but he claims his is.
    Last edited by Bad_Ad84; 08-15-2012 at 01:38 PM.
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  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Druid II View Post
    Eh. The pinouts are:
    - GND, GND, 3.3v, 5v, 9v on all VA0 to VA5 machines (PAL or otherwise)
    - GND, GND, 5v, 5v, 9-12v on all VA6+ machines (PAL)
    - GND, GND, 5v, 5v on all VA6+ machines (NTSC)

    Model 1 saturns are VA0 to 3, Model 2 saturns are VA2 to 15.
    So, model 1 power supplies are freely interchangeable, model 2 ones are only interchangeable for the single-board motherboards.

    The extra fifth pin on va6+ pal machines is ONLY used for the SCART switching voltage. So, if you put a NTSC power supply in a PAL machine, it won't work with the stock PAL Scart cables anymore (it still outputs composite, just not rgb).



    You can't use PAL Scart cables, only specific NTSC ones. Or you have to mod the motherboard.

    4pin power supply means NTSC VA6 to 15 board, it can be any of them, but they all use the same power supply.
    This post was exactly what I was looking for in terms of motherboard revisions

    All I could source was another 4pin 110v model 2 NTSC power supply. So I just bought that and I'm going to buy another step down (a better one) and START AGAIN.

    Plus I have an NTSC scart cable...

    however if someone wants to sell me a 240v model 2 power board please let me know!

    Also, are Jap NTSC model 2 power boards interchangeable with USA NTSC model 2 types?

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bboydocument View Post
    however if someone wants to sell me a 240v model 2 power board please let me know!
    Try making a WTB in the (surprise, surprise) Want To Buy section of the market. Maybe someone will respond.
    Classic hardware collector and modifier. Currently focused on Sega, Xbox, and Nintendo stuff. New Xbox project:
    What ever you do, DON'T CLICK HERE!!!
    I'm now on Sega-16

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bboydocument View Post
    This post was exactly what I was looking for in terms of motherboard revisions

    All I could source was another 4pin 110v model 2 NTSC power supply. So I just bought that and I'm going to buy another step down (a better one) and START AGAIN.

    Plus I have an NTSC scart cable...

    however if someone wants to sell me a 240v model 2 power board please let me know!

    Also, are Jap NTSC model 2 power boards interchangeable with USA NTSC model 2 types?
    I'd recommend buying a model 2 console from ebay UK. You can get working ones from ebay UK for as low as 20Ł, possibly lower if you go for bidding. Just in case it turns out that the actual board was damaged too.

    JP and USA boards are pretty much interchangeable in every single way, only the region setting and the BIOS is different between the two as far as I can tell - the later boards even had both USA and JP product number codes on the same board. This means both the power supplies and the motherboards and generally any other component. PSUs are safe to change, even if one says 100v and the other says 120v on the back of the console: the PSUs themselves are always rated 100-120v.

    NTSC Scart cable will work on PAL consoles as long as they are not "raw sync" cables. If they are, they could potentially damage your TV though.

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  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Druid II View Post
    I'd recommend buying a model 2 console from ebay UK. You can get working ones from ebay UK for as low as 20Ł, possibly lower if you go for bidding. Just in case it turns out that the actual board was damaged too.

    JP and USA boards are pretty much interchangeable in every single way, only the region setting and the BIOS is different between the two as far as I can tell - the later boards even had both USA and JP product number codes on the same board. This means both the power supplies and the motherboards and generally any other component. PSUs are safe to change, even if one says 100v and the other says 120v on the back of the console: the PSUs themselves are always rated 100-120v.

    NTSC Scart cable will work on PAL consoles as long as they are not "raw sync" cables. If they are, they could potentially damage your TV though.
    Thanks heaps! God I hope the actual motherboard isn't damaged!

    Im actually in Australia, and unfortunately the shipping costs are a burden

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Druid II View Post
    NTSC Scart cable will work on PAL consoles as long as they are not "raw sync" cables. If they are, they could potentially damage your TV though.
    Ok, I've had a bit of luck and have sourced a model 2 240v 5pin psu. It's on it's way.

    So I read through your posts and just want to clarify as I'm a bit confused. With a pal power supply, the console will still technically be a NTSC console? So without that 5th pin, am I still going to get RGB with this NTSC scart cable?

    Thanks!

  14. #34
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    yes, thats right.
    Quote Originally Posted by APE View Post
    Legend has it he can ninja a chip into a PS2 while you're playing it and you'll never notice until you reboot.
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  15. #35
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    Great that you got the 240v power supply. I was given an ntsc saturn a while ago where someone had plugged it into an Aussie power point, obviously it went pop. I got a new american power supply as that is all I could find at the time. I have a step down transformer that I use for my desolder gun, plugged it all up and the console works! Just posting this up for a bit of confidence your console should be fine.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by omp View Post
    Great that you got the 240v power supply. I was given an ntsc saturn a while ago where someone had plugged it into an Aussie power point, obviously it went pop. I got a new american power supply as that is all I could find at the time. I have a step down transformer that I use for my desolder gun, plugged it all up and the console works! Just posting this up for a bit of confidence your console should be fine.
    Hey thanks! Greatly appreciated man! :)

  17. #37
    Hey guys, i've installed the 5-pin PAL 220-240v power supply in this US NTSC Sega Saturn with a 4-pin motherboard.

    Before I plug this in and test it out, I want to make sure the correct psu pin is not connected on this 4-pin motherboard. I've circled the pin below, just to be 100% sure this is correct and this is supposed to be the vacant pin.



    (http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/2...tscsspower.png)

    Can someone please let me know if this is right?

    I'm assuming this PAL psu pinout in the picture above is: GND, GND, 5v, 5v, 9-12v
    And here, the 9-12v is not connected

    Thanks heaps

    PS. I should also note, I noticed the plug for the blown US 110v psu actually has one "square end", where as the 240v psu plug accepts the two "round ends". I didn't know this, is this common in the US? I have a PAL playstation2 power cable which seems to fit fine in this new 240v sega saturn psu - safe to use? (I can't use the US power cable as it doesn't fit)
    Last edited by Bboydocument; 08-21-2012 at 06:29 AM.

  18. #38
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    Looks good to me, reference it to this site

    http://seb.riot.org/saturnmod/frontside.sml

    And yes use the standard "figure 8" cable that you mentioned. The original 110VAC supply that was in the Saturn I had had the same deal with the power supply. The replacement one I got had the both rounded edge type.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by omp View Post
    Looks good to me, reference it to this site

    http://seb.riot.org/saturnmod/frontside.sml

    And yes use the standard "figure 8" cable that you mentioned. The original 110VAC supply that was in the Saturn I had had the same deal with the power supply. The replacement one I got had the both rounded edge type.

    SUCCESS, IT WORKS!!!

    Thanks so much, btw I googled everywhere and couldn't find much but that site is a great reference.

    Glad I documented this for those who have no idea what they are doing.

  20. #40
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    Yahoo! Glad it worked for you! Yes if I ever find any handy tit-bits like that, add straight to favourite's!

    Also where did you find the power supply?
    Last edited by omp; 08-21-2012 at 07:47 AM.

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