Dion ,
Where is the proof that there is only 100 copies ?
You can sold again and again some cart secretly .... no one can verify.
And now you claim "over 40 people sent their carts for the verification program " ....
40 people have trusted Dion? 40 people have send their games to Dion?:lol:
The real story is 40 new false kof 2000 US again on the market ( 5000$ each ). 40 x 5000$ = 200k ... good job Dion , your the best.
I'm sure Ebay sales of that crap only go so high due to shill / fake bidding by dickboy here. He has form for it, just ask some of the old school Atari collectors.....
I think his "proof" is that NGF was the official US distributor of NeoGeo games at that time and that they only sold 100 units of KoF 2000. Any other KoF 2000 AES carts of the US region were produced by unofficial means then. These details may be of concern to some collectors who care about the origin of their items. To others (including me) I would only care if the item contained SNK produced parts and not unofficial parts.Originally Posted by teddyufo
SNK-japan and NeoGeoFreak
Proof was there when people contacted SNK-Japan and they gave our NeoGeoFreak contact information and numbers. Also, all KoF2000 carts will be numbered and confirmed with the verification program. Each cartridge and ceritificate will be accounted for with a special holographic serial number. Numbers 001-100. Further proof of only 100 carts in existence.
"You have enemies?
Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life." - - Winston Churchill
You said no one is forced to participate in the program, but do they really have a choice when you tell everyone
**Beware of KoF2000 English Edition cartridges being sold without the proper documentation!!!!
KoF2000 English cartridges should include the following:
NGF authenticity stamp on the insert
NGF distributor sticker on the cartridge
Certificfate of Authenticity
Certificate of Ownership Title
4 special Holographic serial number stickers
(on the CoA, cartridge, back of the insert, back of the manual)
All owners should have their cartridges verified and authenticated.
This is a FREE SERVICE to the initial owners.
For your own protection
Be careful when buying a KoF2000 English Edition cartridge if it does not include all the proper documentation!!
I'd feel pressured in to it, so I would not be at a disadvantage if I went to sell the game, or feel I must explain myself/show my copy is real more than would be necessary normally, all because you come out after 10+ years and say KoF2000 English cartridges should now include more stuff, and say beware of KoF2000 English Edition cartridges being sold without them.
I think doing this now can put original owners who bought the game from you many, many years ago (which is now incomplete) at at disadvantage if they choose not to send the game back to you for the Verification Program, and it's through no fault of their own. :(
...so a bootleg of your bootleg arrives and you're complaining?
Dion ,
you do not answer my questions , the questions is :
- Where is the proof that there is only 100 copies ? or not 144 copies ?
- You have original files insert for reprint again the kof 2000 US , who can control and verify ????? NOBODY !!!!!!!!
You can reprint and convert some Japanese kof 2000 to US version ... no one can verify.
Everyone knows few people will participate in your verification program , 10 people maximum .... you must be crazy to send kof 2000 US to a man of bad reputation.
With your verification program , you can add more kof 2000 US in the market because nothing can be controlled.
Now the value of kof 2000 us down to 450 dollars. thanks dion.
i was missing the point, i must admit
seems a very smooth Kansas City Shuffle
The proof was verified by SNK-Japan .
The proof will be in the certificates and holographic serial number.
There will only be 100 made and all will have the serial numbers. Every certificate is different and will be titled.
We do not have files for KoF2000. The only files we received from snk were for redoing the older style inserts to NGF corrected style.
But thank you for the interest in the certificates. I'm sure other people have questions. I'll try to add some photos later today.
.
.
"You have enemies?
Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life." - - Winston Churchill
When you purchased KoF 2000 you did not also receive any promise of future value. Plus the value of these games is largely inflated because people believe the price the see it listed at on sites like ebay imply actual value. The actual value is how much you can actually get someone to buy it for, which I imagine $450 is alot more than most would pay.
Again, it's a nice thought to "verify" a cartridge's legitimate status. But the most you will ever really know is if the parts in it were made by SNK, or are bootleg parts.
you cant counterfeit counterfeit carts. that like faking fake rollexes
how am i posting??
if you like or dislike the post concider giving me the appropriate reputation
:-)
I'm not getting in the middle of this whole thing but this is what happened from what I recall:
NGFUSA got the permission to do/distribute KOF here because, well, no one else was going to do it.
They received art from Japan but changed it to their insert because, well, they are distributing the game, and that's their prerogative to make sure people know they were the distributor of the cart.
Everyone was all up in arms about it and said the KOFs were fake. Now, I don't have a KOF "US" game but we're talking insert/art/sticker, correct? This is what makes it is a "US" game'' it's something that many people seem to be crazy about because all the carts are the same. Kizuna Encounter is the same Japanese/Euro. You're paying $25,000 for an insert/manual/sticker. That's it. We're not even talking Famicom to NES pins, as far as I know the insides are the same, which brings me to this:
I have not opened a KOF, but logically why would they need to reproduce the KOFs and use EPROMS if the game is the same as the Japanese version ? Makes no sense, so what you are paying for is sticker/insert/manual.
Now, I would LOVE to buy a KOF 2000 USA manual. I just want it for my collection. I don't want the insert/cart, I already have a Japanese one but NGF's version of the English manual I would love to have but it's highly improbable unless Dion is selling extras of these which I don't see what the problem is of him doing that if he had the official rights and there is demand for it...
Please note I am not defending Dion nor do I condone any of the stuff I have read or seen. I am purely a spectator in this whole thing and I like to keep the peace.
I have read some crazy stuff over the years involving NGF and it does look like they were the first with conversions out there, way before anyone else, but the issue that got to this point as to why people are angry with them has to do with whether or not they were claiming their conversions were official SNK releases, or official NGF releases. It is a bit of a twist of words.
Again, I was not involved but it's obvious there are a lot of angry people out there in regards to business they have done.
Personally I think they would do pretty well if they reintroduced conversions because frankly we don't have anyone out here doing that anymore. I just think they were into it when they could get $500-800 for conversions that can be had now for $200-350 but it may not be worth it for them to do that.
Regardless they established "hype" and "controversy" that people keep talking about; it's almost as if you get into the Neo Geo scene you will eventually hear about Dion and NGF.
Look at all these threads again, people keep talking about NGF. It's like I am back in the late 90s, early 2000s, lol...
I enjoy reading these threads though as a spectator...I'm not "for" anyone, I just think there's a lot of stuff either being misunderstood because of the lack of info back then and NGF was able to take advantage of that aspect of the market, but the question still remained as to whether the stuff being marketed was NGF or official SNK, and I've read many times it looks like NGF misappropriated that, but they say they did not, but nothing ever gets completely answered, lol
Assuming NGF was the official distributor acting on SNK's behalf in good faith, then they and SNK know how many orders were received. With NGF's insert changes being approved by SNK. Changing inserts without permission would've likely infringed the copyrights of SNK's art work.
I love the neo-geo scene drama, you can't make this shit up if you tried.
Official distributors and companies don't exactly do that sort of thing. It depends on if the games sell, etc.
I worked for a company that had licensing on official products Capcom gave us rights to do. We had to pay "royalties" on each item sold, nothing about x amount produced and I am pretty sure nothing like that would matter to SNK.
Changing inserts = if you have the rights to something it is subject to APPROVAL from SNK, so if SNK approved that art allowing them to put their website/distributor info on there then there is no problem.
Look at it this way, tons of games released by X company will also have "distributed by, produced by, etc on the actual art. This is nothing new but because it is a Neo Geo game everyone is up in arms about it.
I mean, there is obviously a lot more into this but the answer you just gave is not exactly the correct one. We're talking 100 or so pieces of this game, we're not the ones that produced it.
I know that I can tell you the majority of how many controllers and peripherals were made at companies I worked at (Nubytech/Pelican (PDP) and that's only because I was involved in a lot of those projects...
Like I said personally, I have no attachment to the game, I have the Japanese version. I am not defending collecting it as I know it has a high value and most of you know the type of collector I am, so you know this is not a monetary defensive discussion at all, it's merely a difference between whatever NGF says vs whatever paperwork/legal stuff they have that states they had rights to produce this at whatever was agreed upon between those parties. If they are telling the truth, great, if not, then yes, there is a problem.
Obviously if they made this whole scenario up and forged documents, then this is off the table, but what is this, 2012? We're talking 12 years and this discussion is still going on?
This is what I meant by "hype" and people still talking about NGF, that is why they should still sell things because people know "of" them specifically because they haven't done business in years and they are still being discussed on the forums constantly!
There is a saying that there is no such thing as "negative" press and regardless what is thought about them the company lives on with this type of marketing that they encouraged through discussion and controvery....
The verification system seems kind of broken. Considering it wasn't done from the start, it's kind of impossible to know whats going on, nor if people are being honest.
In addition, the verification system is over a game that apparently has been modified from the original manufactured version and contains non-snk parts. Parts that perhaps anyone could have gotten themselves to do the modification. Regardless if this change was authorized or not, it's pretty much impossible to guarantee which modified cart came from which source. You just have to trust that the modified cart you own is sanctioned because someone said so.
Which brings up the point about modified product to begin with. Most people have a disdain for modified SNK products because usually it means stability issues, possible defects, and other workmanship issues could arise. Unless it came from a factory, I'm highly doubtful an official Neo Geo Freak game would be any more or less reliable than getting an expert modder to do one for me.
It just seems all kind of pointless to be honest. It's about on par with me running a Chinese Famicom Original verification program, to show that my non-nintendo licensed product is more legitimate than another persons non-nintendo licensed product. Even if i was sanctioned, there would be no way to differentiate myself since my production methods would be the same as any other non-nintendo licensed product. The only difference is that you get to feel nice inside that I got sanctioned.
As someone who owns a copy of the game being addressed here (KOF 2000 english) I have to say that I passed on the verification & registering offering.
I already had my game verified by chris when we met up in Manhattan (and bringing a valuable item there was work enough). Apparently I now would have to send it to dion where all 3 pieces (cartridge, insert and manual) will get stickered as it is a mandatory aspect of their service. That just does not sit well with me.
As I discussed with dion on another channel, it is unfortunate that a few pricks from overseas made it so a service like this even had to become a reality but such as life.
Some people will have their carts sent in, others will not. The beauty of it is that there will be collectors that are partial to either version and anyone who buys a non-stickered version from another can always send theirs in.
In all fairness:
I called SNK Japan myself when the english KOF 2000's were released and they did indeed confirm that ngf paid for the run. I will note that the woman on the phone stated that the run was only for 50 pieces but I am pretty sure that that was incorrect (SNK was notorious for flubs like this). There were others who called and received verification as well.
Your claims don't hold much water. It is pretty obvious that the program is being done to protect the 100 legit owners.
That is not true. There are ways to validate & authenticate all parts.
In the matter of KOF 2000 they are all the same cart. there are no "bootleg" carts out there that are comprised of non SNK Eeprom chips. The carts themselves were always affordable and there was no reason to convert or bootleg, it would actually have been counterproductive and more expensive.
Last edited by Core; 01-24-2012 at 01:28 AM.
The fact is that the 100 cartridges would all be pretty much identical to each other in terms of printing, contents, etc. so if you had an original complete copy to hand, it would be very easy to identify and confirm a genuine piece from an import/repro.
To everybody saying "well, how are NGF's carts better than a SNK converted cart? I don't understand the advantage, etc. etc.", put it this way:
Panzer Dragoon Saga for the Saturn is a rare game, but in Japan it is not. If I imported this to the UK, changed the cover, supplied a adapted version in English and sold it to you myself, would it be comparable to one licensed to Sega of Europe/Mastertronic?
Answer: no. Not only would it be illegal to convert the game without prior permission of the rights holder, the value of my copy would be significantly inferior.
So here's the question: why would an unlicensed conversion and import of KoF2000 be any different? It's still modifying the game code, it's still reprinting a cover, it's still illegal according to the licensing agreement that came with the cartridge and it still has nowhere near the value of a genuine NGF conversion.
Last edited by mooseblaster; 01-24-2012 at 06:52 AM.
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