Rosewood. I have two of those clear Saturns, but going to test on crappier model first. Should be the same. It will have to wait for the the weekend however.
Rosewood. I have two of those clear Saturns, but going to test on crappier model first. Should be the same. It will have to wait for the the weekend however.
You guys are cannibalizing the limited-run skeleton machines with this? Jesus.
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It was a EXACT copy of an HI-Saturn (normal model) bios, nothing related to this hacked bios. The Hi-Saturn uses an newer motherboard with a slightly different (also newer) CD-ROM chipset.Originally Posted by Druid II
Last edited by l_oliveira; 07-29-2011 at 01:53 AM.
PlayStation Aficionado.
MSX Maniac.
The Hi-Saturn model 2 (mmp-11) uses a VA9 motherboard with a 32-pin cdrom controller, to the best of my knowledge. But there are plenty of normal saturns that do the same, or in fact have even newer motherboards (up to VA15). All of those use the same 32-pin cdrom controller.
But, all normal Saturns from va1 to va15 use the same bios, stretching out across some 13 different motherboard revisions and at least 5 different cdrom controllers...
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Ya but the YGR chip had some different markings on the original Hi-Saturn board (It was the one where the YGR and SH1 chips were separated)
Still, running that bios made the VA1 Saturn be unable to use the MPEG card. (I only tested the HITACHI card, I'm not sure if that card is coded to assume that when connected to a HI-SATURN it can behave differently without crash the machine...)
PlayStation Aficionado.
MSX Maniac.
The skeleton Saturns are not that limited (50,000 + 20,000 units IIRC) and are easy to come by.
We are not talking about modding HiSaturn Navi consoles here... (although they've been modded in the past too, so why not a region free bios if it fits ;-))
The only hisaturn bios dump floating on the net (1.01) is from a VA0.5 board. It may had some jinx in it that made it incompatible with later boards, which is why they did the 1.02 bios for VA1 hisaturns. For comparison, normal Saturns used 1.00 on VA0 models, and 1.01 on VA0.5 & likely everything else.
Or, the 1.01 hisaturn bios was based on the 1.00 japanese saturn bios, and lacked whatever changes they made later on with the 1.01 japanese saturn bios... This one should be easy enough to check, if you can burn code on that rom. Try putting the 1.00 normal japanese bios on it and see if it behaves the same on your VA1 Saturn.
Last edited by Druid II; 07-30-2011 at 12:23 AM.
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The hi-saturn I had here was the later model so I suppose I'm at fault by using that 1.02 bios on a early USA mobo. :lol:
I used that mobo because it's DIP so I could just shove an DIP EPROM on it... :rolleyes:
PlayStation Aficionado.
MSX Maniac.
Ok here is what I did.
I had a couple of spare Saturn practice boards around, no case/cd, etc.
VA6 - tried the dremel method of bios removal (cut the chips legs) and lost one the bios pcb pads using the soldering iron to clean up :(
VA10 - tried the de-solder method, again lost on the bios pcb solder pads, different pad than above. :( Was able to salvage the JPN bios off this board.
On a US Saturn, VA7 - used dremel method, but cut the chip itself, near the legs, this seemed to cause the legs not to move as much as compared to cutting the metal part of the leg. To clean up the leg I used soldering iron at 650F vs. previously using 900F. All PCB pads look great.
Tried to test fit the IC179 socket from Yamaichi, but its too big, i.e. hits CE37 and C87 on right of bios.
I then wired per Darth's instructions, leg 43 and 44 to CE110 + spot, leg 1 No connection, leg 2 GND, best to lift these legs higher than the others. Now the MX29F800TMC-90 is a little wider than the old bios chip so I used a flat book to help me bend the pins in. Best to bend all the legs in a little, then go back and lift 1,2,43,44. Check to make sure you have the correct width and then solder.
First time I tried and it worked so so. I would sometimes not see the Japanese Sega Saturn logo, then I would get graphic glitches, like dots on the screen and then something in the center of the screen messing up the logo, etc. But the multi-region did work.
I then used the solder iron to re-melt each leg, making sure all looked good. I then re-tested and everything work flawless. I'll do some more testing today, and I have one more Saturn to mod. Not the clear Saturns, but a US model I use in jamma cabinet.
Not sure if related or not, but my green power LED stopped working, going to replace.
Last edited by grips03; 07-30-2011 at 03:02 PM.
So good news is - chips seem OK and how DarthCloud said to program them worked fine with my programmer.
So thats something.
Rosewood - if you are certain its not an installation issue, you can send me back the chips to confirm they were programmed correctly (mistakes can happen, we are all only human)
green power led replaced, working fine now. Confirming bios looks like standard Japanese one with v1.0.1 in lower corner, but US language. This might be because the jumpers on this Saturn are set for US, hence uses English for menu. This is how a Japanese saturn works with a physical region switch.
Here is photo of install.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/2062504...in/photostream
Last edited by grips03; 07-30-2011 at 02:14 PM.
I'm going to try using chip quik to remove the chip on mine. Using a dremel tool is unacceptable given the non-reversible nature. Not too sure chip quik is the best solution but it beats alternatives.
Got to buy me some proper tools.
http://www.assemblergames.com/forums...ad.php?t=31524
My feedback thread, since it seems somewhat difficult for people to find.
Bad news, broke pin 2 on new chip. So tried to remove and then dremel caused another one of those bios pcb pads to lift. :(
I highly recommend you take it very very slow and cut into the old bios chip in up and down motion, don't try to drag the dremel across the legs as this will cause the pads to lift. Repairable, but better to take is slow. Also .015mm solder worked best to solder chip to pcb pad.
Last edited by grips03; 07-31-2011 at 08:59 PM.
you can do chip quik method with leaded solder. chip quik makes it easier (as it stays liquid longer) but the same method works with just using solder. melt solder over all the legs, then melt the solder and it will melt the whole side at once - then lift up with dental pick, repeat on other side.
Also, dont dremel the legs off.... just use some side cutters..
obvious best solution is just buying a hot air rework station :)
APE that looks like good stuff. Watching youtube videos of it. Dremel method is not so hot.
I hate to destroy chips when I'm dismantling stuff. The problem with the SMD Saturn BIOS is that they're GLUED (Exception being the very late boards with Mitsubishi MCU on the CD drive) to the motherboard.
PlayStation Aficionado.
MSX Maniac.
I've been looking at youtube, has anyone used a Hot Air Rework station for stuff like this?
The only chip I desoldered from a Saturn so far was the SMPC, and I did that with a normal fine-tip iron and a small scissor to push up the pins from the underside. This was on a VA0 board and took over an hour, but the chip worked fine a month afterwards when I re soldered it, even though it looked pretty ugly on the board.
Using some kind of solder removal tool would've been much easier, but I'm not sure those work good or at all for such small components. I've yet to try a hot air rework station.
Wait, you said that you put the modded chip into a VA1 Saturn... VA1 Saturns use SOP/SOIC (?) chips, and a 20-pin cdrom. Only VA0 ones use DIP bios chip.
But yeah, it looks like there are motherboard version incompatibilities with the older and newer hi-saturn bioses. I'd love to see how the older/newer standard japanese bioses behave on different motherboard versions though, so we know that the problem is not exclusive to the hi-saturn.
Last edited by Druid II; 07-30-2011 at 09:01 PM.
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double post.
Last edited by Druid II; 07-30-2011 at 09:01 PM.
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