PS3 death clock

[ASSEMbler]

Anyone care to set a time?


I'll bet 15 months until it's 3do'd

[Twimfy]

Interesting.

I haven't looked at any sales figures recently but here in the UK local support for the PS3 seems to be on the rise, I don't know anybody into gaming without one and many friends and family are planning to pick one up for christmas.

Of course my tiny life and circle of acquaintances don't count for much but I'm getting a good feeling about the PS3.

[Rogue]

14

Come on. Subaru withdrew from the World Rally Championship.

What's the importance of a Sony Entertainment division... =P

[sabre470]

Anyone care to set a time?
I'll bet 15 months until it's 3do'd

Do you really believe SCE is going down?

I'd be really pissed now that I have my PS3 :banghead:

But true this generation belongs to Big N and M$ so far... and it's hard to justify the price of a PS3 against a 360 now that you have cheap bluray player on the market.

They took a big bet so you might be right, I'd say leave them another 6 months, let's hope they won't make another stupid move like Home which I think is a complete waste of time and money.

Sabre

[retro]

Interesting.

I haven't looked at any sales figures recently but here in the UK local support for the PS3 seems to be on the rise, I don't know anybody into gaming without one and many friends and family are planning to pick one up for christmas.

I don't have one, and I have the majority of consoles that were released in the UK and several that weren't.

The system is awful. It's overpriced, it's had lots of problems, it had a MAJOR redesign which took out the promised backwards compatability, the controller feels HORRIBLE and the motion control feature was a last minute effort to compete with the Wii's control method.

I know the 360 had some bad press with the red ring problem, but at least Microsoft eventually sorted that with a 3 year warranty. You'd get no such thing from Sony. My 360 is 2 years old now and still going strong. The console is, in my mind, a LOT better than the PS3. It has MANY decent games (not just a handful of decent exclusive games and a lot of rehashes of old 360 games), PROPER backwards compatability that is STILL a feature of modern models, a decent controller (OK let's not mention the D-pad lol) and a nice gamer score system that is easier to view as an overview than the PS3 one. I don't care about blu-ray - it is a console, not a video source. If I want to watch films, I'll get a stand-alone player and NOT wear out my console's drive. ALL my friends have a 360, only some have a PS3. PLENTY of my friends had a PS3 and got rid of it.

As for sales, we were stuck with our initial batch of 1st gen PS3s for a LOONG time. We had to bundle them and drop the price for them to sell. Oh, by long time, I mean we still had them when they were discontinued and hard to find! Conversely, 360s have always sold well and we never had a second hand one remain in stock for longer than a week... and that would be a rarity. They usually sold within 2 days.... sometimes we provisionally sold them before they had been taken in, been tested and paid for!

Whilst you can't really call the Wii a competitor per se, it actually is! It's a great console that's brought fun, original gaming back with its novel control methods. The Wii is still in such demand that there will be supply problems well into next year.

Incidentally, sales figures.

Q1 2007 (taken from MCV but unsure what region):

Wii 259,000
360 199,000
PS3 130,000

May 2007 USA:

Wii 338,000
360 155,000
PS3 82,000

Why am I giving you 2007's data, you ask? Well, Sony has revealed that the year-to-date sales of the PS3 are up 60% on 2007's numbers. November's sales alone (378,071 units) were a 93% improvement over October's.

So let's look at March 2008, almost a year on:

Wii 720,000
360 262,000
PS3 257,000

The year's sales are:

over 2.8 million PS3 consoles
3,552,456 PS3 games

So, how many 360s were sold in November? More than 378,000? Errm, yes. 836,000 360s sold in the US. And the Wii? Over 2 million units!

The Wii has sold 15.4 million units in the US alone.

Incidentally, if you want to get up-to-date statistics, you need to subscribe to www.npd.com for the US and www.chart-track.co.uk for the UK.

[graciano1337]

if it didn't have Bluray i'd agree with you. but Bluray is getting more and more popular all the time. this holiday season is Blu.

[Buyatari]

Anyone care to set a time?


I'll bet 15 months until it's 3do'd

What is the bet?

[Dark Seraph91]

I dont think it will die, Sony has too big of a name. And already has Its name set in stone as being a great blu ray Player, And a moderate Game system.

[ASSEMbler]

What is the bet?

Too bad we don't have a bottle of that awful sony playstation wine for the prize.

Put it this way:

If car mfgs are going under, and the "good" ones (japanese)
are down 30% and hurting what does that say?

If you were a developer and had to spend $15,000,00 on a ps3 title and
sell less, or spend $10,000,000 on a 360 title and sell more, what would you pick? The problem with ps3 is there's no advantage to it.

Carnival games for Wii was made for something like $200,000 and it has sold over 2.6 MILLION copies making the developers some $18,000,000 on their $7 profit per game.

Haze cost something like $15,000,000 and sold only 500K copies. They only make $7.00 a copy, so they lost some 11 million on the game.

-$11,000,000

$15,000,000 makes you ten budget titles for wii.

[retro]

I dont think it will die, Sony has too big of a name. And already has Its name set in stone as being a great blu ray Player, And a moderate Game system.

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/9936/betamaxeg1.jpg

Note: THE LEADER in video recording 1978. By 1980, VHS had 80% of the US market and nearly as much in the UK. Sony switched to VHS production in 1988 in the West, and the last Japanese machine was made in 2002. Most major manufacturers stopped producing VHS machines in 2008, if not before, although there are still some being produced. And don't forget, technically Betamax was the superior format. VHS won basically due to numbers - they got more films on their format.

Sony may have won the format war for HD discs, but they are far from winning the console war. Removing backwards compatability took away thousands of games from the console's library, giving it only a handful of exclusive titles and not all of them were great. However, the Wii has backwards compatability with Gamecube PLUS the download facility for old games, the catalogue for which is growing rapidly. Xbox 360 also has a large amount of Xbox games which work, more being added to the list occasionally, and the downloaded arcade games.

[macwest]

Sony needs a major price drop or the PS3 is dead. For a development company Wii is the best choice. It has the largest ROI or return on investment and is gaining ground. Second is the PS2, I places it second because it is an older console, third is the 360. Unless more PS3 consoles sale the ROI is not high enough to warrent companies making games for it. In the end that can kill the console. As for the argumetn of a blue ray player. I can get a basic blue ray player at wall mart for $150 add an BASIC xbox 360, PS2 or WII and based on which console you are either at or below a prioce of a PS3 price but have more game choices.

[Ground Zero]

Forget about it - although i never liked PlayStation consoles i doubt that it's a sinking ship. There are too many people just buying a PS3 because it's PlayStation. I'm sure Sony will stay Number 3 this generation but they will sell enough consoles to keep it alive for at least 3 more years.
But i think developing and releasing PS4 will be a problem for Sony. I doubt that they will be able to release another home console - maybe they shrink the Cell processor to mobile size and use it for PSP2.

That would be a fine revenge for the PSOne and PS2 domination over Sega Saturn and Dreamcast.

But let's hope Nintendo's casual gaming virus will not doom videogames as we know it! Big profit with bad games is no good combination.

[ASSEMbler]

The problem is sony can't afford to drop the price.

They still lose $250 each ps3. Another cut to be in line with the
360 would mean $350 loss. By being successful they would
go bankrupt. They need to sell TWENTY ONE game per system at this point
to break even. With a $100 price cut that means they need to sell
appx THIRTY GAMES to break even on each ps3.

They never gonna do it. If they had DVD instead of blue ray, they could cut $180 off the ps3 yesterday.

[Alchy]

PROPER backwards compatability that is STILL a feature of modern modelsUh, what? The 360 doesn't have any of the original Xbox hardware in there, it's purely emulation, and it's nothing close to 100%. It's not "proper" backwards compatibility at all.

Total hardware sales so far:
PS3 ~17 million
360 ~22 million
Wii ~34.5 million

PS3 is trailing, but the clear winner is the Wii. Comparatively the 360 and the PS3 are pretty much on equal standing.

I only own the 360, and I'm not slating it at all, but to say the PS3 is dead in the water is ridiculous.

[Tachikoma]

The PS3 is dropping in America but rising in Japan and Europe, those markets can carry it for a long time. It's a good machine, the exclusive games are good, it's only the fact that so many people also have 360's and a lot of games are cross platform that people spout the "there's no games on it" line. Similar with the PSP, sales are nowhere near the DS' but enough for it to carry on with a strong market.

[retro]

Uh, what? The 360 doesn't have any of the original Xbox hardware in there, it's purely emulation, and it's nothing close to 100%. It's not "proper" backwards compatibility at all.


I only own the 360, and I'm not slating it at all, but to say the PS3 is dead in the water is ridiculous.

OK, there are some glitches, but I meant the idea of backwards compatability, not the end result. Sony promised backwards compatability that was meant to be hardware driven, then released it as a software emulation in Europe, much to our annoyance. They had problems with it, then dropped the idea altogether. Microsoft, on the other hand, kept going and sometimes patched the glitches.

I would not be happy to be sold a console with the promise that the amount of old titles that would be compatible would increase, only to find the whole idea dropped not long after!

That said, Nintendo seem to have made the same mistake with the new DS!

I don't think the PS3 is dead and buried quite yet, I'd say it has a good couple of years left. HOWEVER, it is by no means as popular as the other consoles. Yes, it is picking up now, but I don't think it will ever surpass the 360.

[Keiji Dragon]

3 Months.

[PhreQuencYViii]

Uh, what? The 360 doesn't have any of the original Xbox hardware in there, it's purely emulation, and it's nothing close to 100%. It's not "proper" backwards compatibility at all.

Yeah, 360 emulation is pretty lame and they pretty much dropped it, but it's still better then not playing them at all. The games that do work sometimes work better too. Some run like ass. A big thing keeping me from buying a PS3 is no BC. I have no problems dumping my PS2 to save space.

Looks like Wii is the only one with proper BC.

[Alchy]

I would not be happy to be sold a console with the promise that the amount of old titles that would be compatible would increase, only to find the whole idea dropped not long after!Most PS3s still come with the PS2's GPU hardware in it and subsequently have PS2 compatibility on a level similar to the 360. As I understand it, the only model that doesn't have backwards compatibility of PS2 titles is the 40GB model, comparable to the 360 Arcade, which also doesn't have BC. Personally I don't think any of these situations are satisfactory - hardware BC is superior, and at least early PS3s had that.


HOWEVER, it is by no means as popular as the other consoles. Yes, it is picking up now, but I don't think it will ever surpass the 360.They're both fairly comparable in terms of sales, so I don't know what you mean by "popularity".

If nothing else, I find the idea that Sony would cancel their leading Blu-Ray player kind of silly. Every Blu-Ray player out there increases Blu-Ray disc sales.

[retro]

Yeah, 360 emulation is pretty lame and they pretty much dropped it, but it's still better then not playing them at all. The games that do work sometimes work better too. Some run like ass. A big thing keeping me from buying a PS3 is no BC. I have no problems dumping my PS2 to save space.

Looks like Wii is the only one with proper BC.

Quite. The Wii has TRUE support, and is superb. Microsoft haven't released an update in a year, which is disappointing, but there are still almost 500 games that are compatible, basically half of the Xbox library. The REALLY impressive thing is that an unreleased game is on the list!!!

[BahnNZ]

I give it 8 more years then it's f**ed. :)

[Buyatari]

Carnival games for Wii was made for something like $200,000 and it has sold over 2.6 MILLION copies making the developers some $18,000,000 on their $7 profit per game.

Haze cost something like $15,000,000 and sold only 500K copies. They only make $7.00 a copy, so they lost some 11 million on the game.

-$11,000,000

$15,000,000 makes you ten budget titles for wii.

You are taking a rare example. Most 3rd party Wii games SUCK and have poor sales. Almost every game that was made for all 3 systems had the lowest sales on the Wii version. The controller scheme was too much of a gap to jump.

Many people who buy a wii have ONE game. The pack in. All those older non gamers bought it to play the bowling game have a whopping 1 game. Some of them bought Wii Play but you won't find many 50+ "gamers" with more than 3 games tops. Huge system sales on the Wii do not mean you will sell more games.

[Yakumo]

Here in japan the PS3 is just another thing on the shelf. In fact in most stores around here the 360 has just as much shelf space.

yakumo

[Ryusui]

I wouldn't put a death clock on the PS3, but I do see it trailing both Nintendo and Microsoft for the rest of the generation.

The bottom line is, the PS3 was the wrong thing. Sony's grand plan was for its Playstation to evolve into the core of every living room, an all-powerful box that could play anything, do anything, launch your media experience INTO THE YEAR 2000!...except it came out in 2006. The hype failed to produce anything that hadn't already been thought of, and the fact that the PS3 was the cheapest Blu-Ray player on the market was made meaningless by the simple fact that there was, and still is, no real market for Blu-Ray DVDs.

It's been argued that Nintendo has alienated its original demographic; the fact is, it's Sony that alienated its original demographic, and they've been trying to catch up since launch. All their bluster about how we'd bend over and take the higher price tag just because it's a Playstation? About how rumble was yesterday's news? They were mistakes and they knew it. They were just too damn arrogant to fix them before everyone pointed out that the Emperor of the Console Wars had forgotten his pants before entering the ring.

Home is a shining example of what's wrong with Sony. The Mythbusters have proven that yes, it is possible to polish a piece of crap, but that doesn't change the fact that the lustrous sphere in your hands is a pretty pile of feces. There isn't anything really to it; at best it's a glorified chatroom whose only claim to fame is browser-quality minigames that...drumroll, please...you have to wait in line to play! Just like in real life! OMG WOW!!!!ONE!!!!ELEVEN!!!!1337!!!! Home is everything that's wrong with Sony nicely encapsulated in a single free download: it runs off of hype.

Now, don't get me wrong. I have a PS3 and I love the damn thing. But just because I've bought the console doesn't mean I've forgiven Sony for its history of errors, or the mistakes it's still making.

[liquitt]

Too bad we don't have a bottle of that awful sony playstation wine for the prize.


i got 'em ;)

well, what confuses me the most about Sony is, that they're planning to sell every item they have more expensive than before in europe!

[karsten]

The problem is sony can't afford to drop the price.

They still lose $250 each ps3. Another cut to be in line with the
360 would mean $350 loss. By being successful they would
go bankrupt. They need to sell TWENTY ONE game per system at this point
to break even. With a $100 price cut that means they need to sell
appx THIRTY GAMES to break even on each ps3.

They never gonna do it. If they had DVD instead of blue ray, they could cut $180 off the ps3 yesterday.

I would call the ps3 more like a Saturn than a 3do :P

if i have the time I'll search again for the interview to a market analyst and a sony insider stating that sony since a few months ago is actually getting money by selling each machine on a figure of +40/50$...

back on topic, i don't consider the ps3 having a launch until GT and FFXIII are out. If with the release of FF ps3 will still be weak.... say goodbye to it. Also i smell a substantial price drop in the new year.

surely things are gloom for sony this time and the announcement that GT might not be out before NEXT xmas is not a good thing.

[XxHennersXx]

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y82/XxhennersXx/01772.jpg

18 months

[Drew]

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y82/XxhennersXx/01772.jpg

18 months
I have no idea what that has to do with anything, but I fully support anything Dethklok does.

[graciano1337]

the title of the thread is PS3 deathclock.

[kammedo]

But let's hope Nintendo's casual gaming virus will not doom videogames as we know it! Big profit with bad games is no good combination.


*shrigs* God damn it NO!

[Yakumo]

I would call the ps3 more like a Saturn than a 3do No way. The Saturn had a very healthy following in Japan, something the PS3 hasn't got or ever did have.

Yakumo

[Parris]

Yeah, last year the inclusion of the Blu Ray player in the PS3 was a good ploy and bound to help sell units, but if you are a film fan rather than a gamer there are a few more options these days including much cheaper stand alone players.

Sony needs to drop the price of the PS3 very swiftly to attract new customers asap.

The Wii is a fun console, but I never use it. The 360 is a serious piece of hardware, now available for almost fuck all and bound to be picking up thousands of sales more than the PS3 on that fact alone now that everyone is watching every penny they spend.

Not sure Sony will drop the PS3, but it's the developers who often make or break a console.

[oldengineer]

Stand alone Blu-ray layers are definately gonna be the death nail in the PS3's coffin.

...Up until they appeared the PS3 had a 'healthy' following of movie buff's, well certainly in the U.K

As for the games function of the console, well, there's barely been a handful of games, so buying a PS3 to use purely as a 'games console' has so far been a strict 'no-no' up till now. (again speaking from a U.K perspective)

...So in summary, yeah Kev's estimate of 18 months could indeed prove to be true.

[Parris]

Shame really as I love it... if it dies that'll be Sony out of the gaming market unless they stick a new case on the PS2 and sell it as the next contender lol

[karsten]

Shame really as I love it... if it dies that'll be Sony out of the gaming market unless they stick a new case on the PS2 and sell it as the next contender lol

add a wiimote to the pack and sell for 259$ :D

[3do]

To me the PS3 isn't something that i think WOW i want one like the ps2 did and it doesn't have a big amount of must have or good games to make it a must have machine for gaming.

Also i think that its trying to be more of a media device than a games console where as i see the 360 as first and foremost a games console which happens to have extra features that i can use if i wanted to and as for the wii that is something playing family games and just having some fun without having to get seriously involved in how to play the games.

[port187]

- I don't care about backwards compatibility, I collect retro BUT not from a generation ago.. it's shit until its really old :) so for now ill stick to ps3 games with great graphics or 8/16 bit games for the retro experiance.
- PS3 is build for the long run
- I dont need to replace it every half year or so as I did with the 360.
- All 3 consoles have downloads of classic games
- The price will eventually go down.
- Bluray is not just for movies, but also a great medium to store LOTS of data! were 360 is stuck to dual layer DVD as a max.
- But I will agree that 360 has more and better games... but whatever I can buy a 360 next to the PS3 seeing as it comes free with a pack of milk nowadays.
- I don't like to pay for online play.. allthough xbox live is of better quality I dont want to pay for it.. I did it previous and it took me a year to get rid of the subscription as they kept taking money from my cc eventhough I didn't own a 360 anymore for months after the 3th RROD.
- The PS3 doesnt make noise like a helicopter when playing games and it doesnt scratch them neighter.
- Sony can handle the loss and when they decide to release a cheaper version of the PS3 the sales will rock as its still the "rich man's" console like the 3do was and so most kids dream that don't have the budget at the moment.

Damn.. did I become a fan boy? or am I in self denile because I don't want to loose my money?? :P anyway it's a great console and I am happy with it.. also love the picture viewing, music player and yes even the streaming divx (it plays 9 out of 10 movies and thats fine! and spares me to keep my ugly a*s xbox1 in the living room stinking up the place looking like something from the 80ties)

PS: I loved the 3DO and I still do!!! :)

[Quzar]

As to the sales figures people have been posting. I had read as early as 4 years ago that Sony released sales data for its consoles as number shipped as opposed to numbers sold. Is that still true in these Playstation 3 sales charts? Or is it that they still do so but others are able to accurately keep track?

Either way, I hope it dies soon. It would put blu-ray to sleep as a mainstream format, relegating it to LD status for videophiles or whatnot and allow for another format to pop up.

[Alchy]

Either way, I hope it dies soon. It would put blu-ray to sleep as a mainstream format, relegating it to LD status for videophiles or whatnot and allow for another format to pop up.Another video format? Yeah, just what we need.

[Tachikoma]

No way. The Saturn had a very healthy following in Japan, something the PS3 hasn't got or ever did have.

Yakumo

Odd, because every time I play a game on the Japanese servers they are full of plenty of people.

[PhreQuencYViii]

Another video format? Yeah, just what we need.

I miss HDDVD. There was nothing wrong with it too. =(

[sephiap]

Man way to start this thread one week after I handed over 300 english pounds for an 80GB model. Just as I was thinking "you know, there's not much to it, prefer my 360...", "well I guess I can play the exclusives at least...", "it's black, and shiny..." - excuses to keep it were wearing thin after a couple of days. Now this.

Kinda hope it does die, seems that SONY has been arrogant in every sense and needs to be taken down a few notches.

[Alchy]

I miss HDDVD. There was nothing wrong with it too. =(I'd have gone for HD-DVD over Blu-Ray, but we don't need two, and what I actually meant was that a new format is definitely not needed at this stage. HD VMD anyone?

[graciano1337]

I miss HDDVD. There was nothing wrong with it too. =(

a lot of customers i talk to at work are just fine with regular-ray.

after seeing Transformers in Blu-ray, however, i try to watch every newer movie on Blu-ray. i just watched Resident Evil Degeneration and it looked VERY nice. even some older movies like Patton look amazing. i still think they're too expensive to buy though.

[3do]

Me or my father have not got into Blu-Ray as much as we got into DVD when it first arrived and i have a massive collection DVD's and a sony dvp-cx850d which i don't want to get rid of just to get a better picture when right now i don't have a HD tv and DVD gives me a good picture anyway and i don't want the few extra feautres that you get at the moment

I think Sony though that like the PS2's DVD drive and DVD playback that adding Blu-Ray drive sell more units becuase of this but unlike DVD blu-ray hasn't really taken of as quick and its taking time for more and more people to go blu-ray

[PhreQuencYViii]

a lot of customers i talk to at work are just fine with regular-ray.

after seeing Transformers in Blu-ray, however, i try to watch every newer movie on Blu-ray. i just watched Resident Evil Degeneration and it looked VERY nice. even some older movies like Patton look amazing. i still think they're too expensive to buy though.

Lol, gotta love regular-ray.

My friend was complaining he couldn't find Dark Knight in full screen. About slapped him. Still haven't seen it although the blu ray version is sitting around on my....nevermind.

[wildcat]

Sales in blue ray must be lousy were I live cause they have 2 tv setup side by side and are comparing the 2, Lol!



What a bunch of idiots!:shrug:

[Yakumo]

Odd, because every time I play a game on the Japanese servers they are full of plenty of people.So are the Xbox 360 ones. After all they are Japanese servers. Japanese are well known for keeping away from the western servers. The PS3 is only bought in Japan by those who can't let go of the brand. The 360 although doing bad in sales is what the hardcore gamer buys (the ports of shooters just goes to show that) while everyone else and their dog buys a Wii.

Yakumo

[PhreQuencYViii]

If I can, depending on the game, I try to play with Japanese people. I had a few good japanese buds on my friends list for awhile, mostly from DOA.

I'm actually playing my Wii for once...trying to finish the stars in Mario Galaxy and just got Sonic.

[XxHennersXx]

Odd, because every time I play a game on the Japanese servers they are full of plenty of people.

Yes. all twenty PS3 ownsers.

I kid.

[grahf]

Bluray sure does look awesome, but for the extra price over DVDs is just not worth it. Especially since I no longer have a bigscreen TV since moving to Japan.

Also, I can't remember any more but were DVDs this much more expensive than VHS when they came out? I seem to remember DVDs being $18, and VHS being $12-15.. Dark Knight (which seems to be THE bluray disk right now) is $24 compared to $15 for DVD. I havn't really compared prices in yen.

[Drew]

I've never even seen a Blu-Ray disc before.

God I'm poor.

[lwizardl]

Well I'm not a fan of sony products the last sony product I really enjoyed was my playstation1 (SCPH-1000, and SCPH-5501 models). I own a 60GB PS3 that includes PS2 playback, and Nintendo Wii (WiiKey installed), and Xbox 360 x3 (USA, JPN, and a USA system with an Infectus installed). I also agree that the PS3 is dying I've had my system now for about a year and a half and still own the same 3 games I got with my system. Resistance, NFS Carbon, Madden 07. I've rented about 25 games for the system and none I'd be willing to buy.

I'm going to say the PS3 has about 19 months left and then its dead. I'm going to guess July 17, 2010 (just a feeling but I'm sure I'm going to be wrong).

[retro]

Also, I can't remember any more but were DVDs this much more expensive than VHS when they came out? I seem to remember DVDs being $18, and VHS being $12-15.. Dark Knight (which seems to be THE bluray disk right now) is $24 compared to $15 for DVD. I havn't really compared prices in yen.

When DVDs came out in England, they were £20 each. That would be about $25 in those days. VHS was about £12 at the same time, or $15. So yes, they were THAT much more expensive.

[Barc0de]

dvd had clear benefits over VHS, the same cannot be said to the same extent when comparing DVD to HD video formats however, hence why I think that Bluray is not for everyone - only people who actually care.

[Baseley09]

If you're not a foolish shopper, Blurays can be had online for little more than their DVD counterparts and for the slim price top up are worth it.....paying over the odds for bluray then no way, but that's peoples fault as bad shoppers.

I'm not a massive Sony console fan, and in a gaming respect there isn't much ive found on the system worth playing, but from what I have played i've largley enjoyed, and the PSN is a marvel.

I use the Playstation 3 on a daily basis for numerous applications its become my main entertainment hub and in this regard, is an excellent peice of kit for the money - if the gaming side fails, you still have a worthy peice of hardware.

It's true to say that these days I am more of an AV enthusiast than gaming if that adds any weight to my post.

[Alchy]

PSN is a marvel.PSN tends to get overlooked, compared to XBLA, and I'm not sure why. It's a decent service and the prices are great. Honestly, if I was to buy a PS3 it'd mostly be for PSN.

[Jamtex]

The PS3 is only bought in Japan by those who can't let go of the brand. The 360 although doing bad in sales is what the hardcore gamer buys (the ports of shooters just goes to show that) while everyone else and their dog buys a Wii.

And Yakumo shows his anti sony bias yet again... Yes the PS3 is only bought by people who really like Sony and not by people say who might want to play more serious games, if you took one look at the top ten selling PS3 games in Japan you might learn something, no one in there right mind would serious buy a Wii if they wanted to play say a decent driving game...

Everyone and his dog buys a wii, thats probably quite true, have a good look at the charts and you might find wii games that a dog could probably play. :110: Also count the number of Wii games that you could have bought on the Playstation 2... no good praising DDR now, it's not like it's been around for years mainly on the PS and PS2.

Not sure what shops you been going to but the shops I went to before I left Japan still had bigger PS3 sections then Xbox, add PS2 and PSP and most shops did have bigger Sony sections then Nintendo. :nod:

The XBox 360 is getting more the the hardcore games that would have been on the Playstation 2 although they are still selling badly, most not even getting 10,000 sales. When Edge did their feature on shooters, they covered three games Fantasy Zone, Thunderforce IV and Raiden IV, guess which one sold the least?

The Playstation 3 was hampered by the removal of PS2 compatability although nice to see that if you can find a 60gb model it's only 20,000 to 40,000 yen more expensive then what it was new, although I did see a new 60gb machine going for 100,000. :crying:

I still think the Wii will be replaced before the Playstation 3 will be.

[Johnny]

Blu-ray "promotion" start a couple of months down here.

Still, a cheap DVD player can be bough for 89 Reais. The cheapest Blu-Ray player costs 1.999 Reais.

Not to mention DVDs are really cheap here. New releases cost 50 Reais and in a month or two go to 29 Reais. A Blu-ray release costs 149 Reais.

So, no Blu-ray big sales anytime soon.

As for Death of any consoles, all 3 sell well down here (even if they cost a lot of money). The non-piracy PS3 is actually saving a lot of game shops from being out of business...

[Pikkon]

I still think the Wii will be replaced before the Playstation 3 will be.

PS3 is the worst selling console for Sony,even the PS2 sells better.If it gets worse they will pull the plug.The Wii will stay.

[Jamtex]

PS3 is the worst selling console for Sony,even the PS2 sells better.If it gets worse they will pull the plug.The Wii will stay.

Oh put your brain into gear before typing, the PS2 worldwide has not outsold the PS3 since March and even then it was by a tiny ammount, since then the PS3 has been selling reasonably. Before you say well in America / Europe, a quick check of sales figures will still show the PS3 outselling the PS2. The Playstation 2 is a bread and butter machine now but the fact it's still selling and games are still being made does show like the PS1 did before it that there is still a market and Sony can sell both machines.

[Druid II]

dvd had clear benefits over VHS, the same cannot be said to the same extent when comparing DVD to HD video formats however
Then you never compared a DVD to a good quality HD movie. Or you only saw low-bitrate mpeg2 1080i HDTV transfers.

Seriously, the quality difference between HD and SD is at least as much as DVD to VHS.

Of course, it's true that HD movies don't introduce as many other elements to the mainstream as DVD did (menus, instant scene skipping, extras, better handling, superior soundtracks, etc). But quality wise, once you are used to HD quality, DVD will seem like a blurry pos.

This is provided you have a display for it, but you can easily use a PC monitor for this, that's what I do.

[Alchy]

All the doom and gloom PS3 comments kind of remind me of the ridiculous "OMG GMAING INDUSTRY ARE GOING TO DEAD" shit we had here a couple of years ago. It's odd and completely unjustified conjecture. The idea that Sony would abandon their lead platform (and their trojan horse Blu-Ray player) when sales are on a par with their nearest competitor is fucking stupid, and I'm tired of reading it.

If you think the PS3 is dead in the water then you have to accept that the 360 is too. They have both shipped a similar number of units, and the 360 had a year's head start. I like my 360, and it's got a lot of play recently, but at some point past the age of 13 you have to stop bashing the competition just because you don't own one.

I'm not trying to point to anyone in particular on this, except maybe Yakumo, but I think he's pretty much used to the accusations of favouritism at this stage. The fact is that the PS3 has sold something close to seventeen million units. There is no console in history that has bowed out in its early life after those kind of sales. Love it or hate it (I sit comfortably in the middle bit labelled "apathy"), the PS3 is going to be here for a while.

[PhreQuencYViii]

And Yakumo shows his anti sony bias yet again... Yes the PS3 is only bought by people who really like Sony and not by people say who might want to play more serious games, if you took one look at the top ten selling PS3 games in Japan you might learn something, no one in there right mind would serious buy a Wii if they wanted to play say a decent driving game...

In my experience, yeah, it is. The people I know with PS3's are so serious about playing games they don't play any at all.

What are the top selling PS3 games in Japan? MGS4 has got to be one of them.

[Jamtex]

Playstation 3 games in Japan that have sold over 150,000 units and basically third party publishers do sell more games on the Playstation 3 then they do on the Wii despite the over double the amount of units in Japan).

Metal Gear Solid 4 (Konami) - 658,000 (Can you guess the biggest selling Konami game on the Wii? Powerful Pro Baseball, which sold 138,000 units... the best selling baseball game also by Konami was Pro Yakyuu Spirits 5 which sold 112,000 )
Minna no Golf 5 (Sony) - 488,000
Gran Turismo 5 Prologue (Sony) - 421,000 (The above two are the only Sony games that have sold over 150,000)
Shin Sangoku Musou 5 (Koei) - 411,000 (Koei on the Wii? Just about but tiny tiny numbers)
Winning Eleven 2008 (Konami) - 321,000 (The silly Wii version of the game, sold 109,000)
Devil May Cry 4 (Capcom) - 312,000 (Resident Evil - Umbrella Cronicles sold 281,000 units)
Gundam Musou (Koei) - 301,000
Ryu ga Gotoku Kenzan (Sega) - 277,000 (Segas best Wii game Fushigi no Dungeon - Furai no Shiren 3 sold 105,000)
Winning Eleven 2009 (Konami) - 237,000
Grand Theft Auto IV (Capcom) - 195,000 (nearly 4 times as many as the Xbox 360 version in Japan)
Dragonball Z - Burst Limit (Namco Bandai) - 174,000 (Namco Bandai are one of the few third party companies to do well selling 244,000 copies of Dragonball Z - Budokai TenKaichi 3)
Ridge Racer 7 (Namco Bandai) - 153,000
Senjou no Valkyria - Gallian Chronicles (Sega) - 152,000

[Yakumo]

A if you took one look at the top ten selling PS3 games in Japan you might learn something, no one in there right mind would serious buy a Wii if they wanted to play say a decent driving game...No, they'd buy a 360

[retro]

No, they'd buy a 360

Damn you! I was about to say that!! :lol:

Don't get me wrong, Gran Turismo is a great game. And it is certainly one that would be on the list that would make me consider getting a PS3. However, it isn't enough to make me say OMG I *NEED* A PS3!!! Oh, that F1 game that came out early on was pretty decent from the demo I played, too.


If you think the PS3 is dead in the water then you have to accept that the 360 is too. They have both shipped a similar number of units, and the 360 had a year's head start. I like my 360, and it's got a lot of play recently, but at some point past the age of 13 you have to stop bashing the competition just because you don't own one.

Quite. Fanboyism isn't a reason alone to slate the opposition. However, it is a reason not to buy something - fair enough. Likewise, though, you can't praise something without praising the others, too. OK Jamtex, so the PS3 has 14 titles that sold over 150k units. Now how many on the Wii have sold that many? Or the 360?

Also, what are the JAPANESE sales figures of Xbox 360 vs PS3 like? Hardware, I mean. You'd expect the Xbox to do poorer in Japan, but it sounds like it's doing OK, yes?

That's why I based my thoughts on FACT. Sure, I gave some personal opinion - yes I've played PS3, yes the graphics look good but I want something more than fancy cosmetic wankery from a games console. The pad feels shit - I find it very uncomfortable to hold and use the triggers, worse than a PS2/PSX pad and I found that a little awkward sometimes. However, my prediction was based on having worked in video game retail and SEEING FIRST HAND how well the PS3 does against the 360. I seem to have given one of the longest predictions with 2 years, too!! lol.

C'mon guys. The PS3 may be struggling, but Sony aren't just going to write it off. Even Betamax had 14 years of manufacture in the West DESPITE being outsold 3 to 1 within 5 years! And they'd at least need a new machine to replace it - that or announce their retirement from the console world like Sega, and that won't happen.

[oldengineer]

But quality wise, once you are used to HD quality, DVD will seem like a blurry pos.

Spot on!

:clap:

[Alchy]

Also, what are the JAPANESE sales figures of Xbox 360 vs PS3 like? Hardware, I mean. You'd expect the Xbox to do poorer in Japan, but it sounds like it's doing OK, yes?A quick glance at Wikipedia shows PS3 has outsold it 3:1 - 2.3 million PS3s vs 750k Xbox 360s. Again, that's despite a year's head start for the 360. It's the only place in the world where the PS3 is really dominating the 360. Of course neither come close to Wii's 7 million, or the 24 million DS systems (yeah, that's Japan alone).

Maybe we should have a "360 death clock" thread since Microsoft are obviously doing so badly in Japan that they're going to drop support over there. Or maybe we could just drop the bullshit and accept that all three companies are in it for the long haul.

[jammi]

Then you never compared a DVD to a good quality HD movie. Or you only saw low-bitrate mpeg2 1080i HDTV transfers.

Seriously, the quality difference between HD and SD is at least as much as DVD to VHS.

Of course, it's true that HD movies don't introduce as many other elements to the mainstream as DVD did (menus, instant scene skipping, extras, better handling, superior soundtracks, etc). But quality wise, once you are used to HD quality, DVD will seem like a blurry pos.

This is provided you have a display for it, but you can easily use a PC monitor for this, that's what I do.

i hate watching dvds now i cant wait for the blu-ray to come out of a movie

[port187]

Or maybe we could just drop the bullshit and accept that all three companies are in it for the long haul.

Best reply until now :)

[Barc0de]

it could be an uphill struggle for Sony but I think they should put it down to experience and design the PS4 with games as their main focus this time around.

[PhreQuencYViii]

It's not like it matters what the fuck many units sony or nintendo or microsoft sell of conkers bad fur day. There not giving me money! And it's not like the general public buys good games all the time, so whatever.

[Unorthodox]

I could've sworn I clicked on assemblergames.com in my bookmarks and not UKresistance.co.uk .....strange.

[Johnny]

Damn you! I was about to say that!! :lol:

Don't get me wrong, Gran Turismo is a great game. And it is certainly one that would be on the list that would make me consider getting a PS3. However, it isn't enough to make me say OMG I *NEED* A PS3!!! Oh, that F1 game that came out early on was pretty decent from the demo I played, too.


I totally agree with you. Heck, i have 3 GT releases for PS3, and still i'm not inclined to spend between 1.500 and 2.000 Reais on the console.

It's not like i don't have the money, it's just not worth it... yet. Maybe after March, i will think about it.

[Alchy]

I could've sworn I clicked on assemblergames.com in my bookmarks and not UKresistance.co.uk .....strange.I would've thought the lack of satire here would alert you, if the colour scheme didn't.

[PhreQuencYViii]

I'm considering buying a PS3 next year, probably after January...if anything it would be nice to play PS and PS2 on a wireless controller.

[Nakian]

Ive been owning a PS3 for about a year now and Im very pleased because I needed the space my PSX and PS2 used to occupy and some of the pc like features the console has to offer,again due to space problems

but sure.....I got a wii and was blown away by zelda tp and mario galaxy whereas on the PS3 its pretty much only MGS4 that is still in my mind as a top game,I also think that dropping the dual shock element and supporting half-heartedly the backwards compatibility were definately VERY bad moves by sony

not only that but sony also chose to enforce regional lockouts for PS1 and PS2 games but not for PS3 ones,a move that I dont understand since only the latter will have an important market to deal with,now i have tons of import games which I cant play because of this

the PS3 feels easily accessible on the media platform but comes very short in the gaming sector IMO

they have tons of models with different features where nobody really knows what to expect if he/she doesnt look for information

why not just release a PS3 model without the whole media crap?a model that plays ONLY PS3 games?wouldnt that be cheaper?oh i forgot the blu-ray stuff is dictating here....

[3do]

why not just release a PS3 model without the whole media crap? a model that plays ONLY PS3 games? wouldnt that be cheaper? oh i forgot the blu-ray stuff is dictating here....

I'm not against media capabilities of the ps3 but couldn't sony have concentrated on the gamming side of the ps3 and worried about media and everything else for future updates??

I know sony probably wanted a machine capable of being used for all your media needs but to be honest if i had the need or chance to i'd rather build/buy myself a decent media centre/HTPC and have it next to a 360, wii and ps3 so that the console could do my gaming and the PC left for everything else.

[Christer-swe]

Many people who buy a wii have ONE game. The pack in. All those older non gamers bought it to play the bowling game have a whopping 1 game. Some of them bought Wii Play but you won't find many 50+ "gamers" with more than 3 games tops. Huge system sales on the Wii do not mean you will sell more games.

Yeah, but Ninty makes a profit out of every console they sell, unlike Sony and MS who NEEDS to sell plenty of games to break even.

Ninty still has the luxury of not having to reduce to price since launch. If Ninty would hit a bump they could easily reduce the price. Something Sony can't afford.

[Alchy]

Last I checked both Microsoft and Sony were making a small sum on each console sold.

[wildcat]

I wish someone in this thread would have provide a link to offical sales stats. :crying:

[Parris]

Last I checked both Microsoft and Sony were making a small sum on each console sold.

Really? I thought after the whole faulty ass Microsoft Xbox 360 debacle that frankly Microsoft would be waiting years (if ever) to make anything from the 360.

I remember it wasn't until the original Xbox was just about to be axed that they finally turned the corner. I think they made $5.00 on it, which they then wisely spent on the R&D for the 360 cooling system. That appears to have been their entire cooling budget ;-)

That was a joke btw... there is no WAY they spent as much as $5.00 on the R&D on the 360's original cooling system! ;-)

[Alchy]

Official sales stats can be found, wait for it... Wikipedia!


Really? I thought after the whole faulty ass Microsoft Xbox 360 debacle that frankly Microsoft would be waiting years (if ever) to make anything from the 360.In terms of profit for the gaming division as a whole, sure. In terms of profit per unit it's been profitable for ages now. Someone posted about the $250 loss per unit that Sony were soaking up when the PS3 was launched, and that's long since dropped. Again, Wikipedia has sources for you to check this out, I'm not going there again today for the same thing.

[Parris]

Official sales stats can be found, wait for it... Wikipedia!

In terms of profit for the gaming division as a whole, sure. In terms of profit per unit it's been profitable for ages now. Someone posted about the $250 loss per unit that Sony were soaking up when the PS3 was launched, and that's long since dropped. Again, Wikipedia has sources for you to check this out, I'm not going there again today for the same thing.

Hmmm, Wiki... I always believe everything I read on Wiki! Anyone got official MS / Sony details?

[MottZilla]

I don't think Sony will die. Too many idiots that have boners for anything with the Playstation logo on it. Now the PS1 atleast deserved praise. But Sony has done a complete 180 since the PS1. The PS1 was cheaper, easier to develop for, and I don't think they made a big deal over it playing audio CDs. The PS2 design I think was lazy, and they focused alot on the DVD movie player early on when games were lacking. With the PS3 they've gone even further. Expensive, hard to develop for, and they pitch so much "capability" that has nothing to do with making great games.

The 360 seems to follow the PS1 in that it's cheap, easy to develop for, and while it also plays the act of the swiss army knife, atleast they didn't raise costs to do it like Sony did with Bluray. Yes I know Blu-ray adds storage for games, but we all played multi disc games before so that's a bullshit feature when it adds over 100$ to the unit cost.

[Alchy]

Hmmm, Wiki... I always believe everything I read on Wiki! Anyone got official MS / Sony details?I hate to be rude mate, but did you actually read what you quoted? "Again, Wikipedia has sources for you to check this out". I'm not asking you to believe what some basement dweller imagines is the number of units sold. Go read the sources and decide for yourself.

[mr. newbie]

the 360 and ps3 are so similar. i really don't understand the hate coming from either side. they offer a lot of the same functionality (they excel in different areas though.)

they play the same games with almost identical graphics.

[Christer-swe]

Last I checked both Microsoft and Sony were making a small sum on each console sold.

That would truly be amazing, since they lost money on every machine sold on launch, and has since then cut the price by nearly half, if not more. (Not counting all the money they've put on making new versions of their machines.)

[virtual alan]

Yeah, last year the inclusion of the Blu Ray player in the PS3 was a good ploy and bound to help sell units, but if you are a film fan rather than a gamer there are a few more options these days including much cheaper stand alone players.

Sony needs to drop the price of the PS3 very swiftly to attract new customers asap.

The Wii is a fun console, but I never use it. The 360 is a serious piece of hardware, now available for almost fuck all and bound to be picking up thousands of sales more than the PS3 on that fact alone now that everyone is watching every penny they spend.

Not sure Sony will drop the PS3, but it's the developers who often make or break a console.


I agree that the PS3 price has got to drop

I mean I posted a thread the other day that ZAVVI are selling the arcade 360 for £99....PS3 £270 or whatever it is.......so it has a blu ray player.....who wants to pay £20 on average for a blu ray disk, I know can be had cheaper if you hunt but just using for an example.

It just can`t go on like this at this price.............as well as so many versions then with / without backward compatibility and then without / with rumble pad and now so many hard-drive variants..............no wonder people don`t want to buy it...............apart from hardcore gamers or Sony fanboys. I would not have one if I didn`t get mine for nothing

[Tachikoma]

At the end of the day, if you don't want a PS3, or a Wii, or a 360, just don't buy the damn things and stop moaning about the competition!

No bugger is forcing you to buy one, if someone enjoys their PS3/360/Wii and you don't, leave them to enjoy their console(s)

Honest to god, it's like a bunch of school kids fighting about who is the best football team.

[wildcat]

Alchy,

I don't doubt microsoft made money and I bet more than sony did on there console, but I do like somethings about the ps3 like its exterior looks for 1.


Parris,

You sound alittle bit cranky and anti microsoft in your last post? why my dear friend?:shrug:


Did you own a 360 console?

[Barc0de]

i m just in it for the sony bashing - i do own a ps3 and play sometimes too=) :P

[Barc0de]

http://gizmodo.com/5116869/ps3-cheaper-than-ever-to-make-sony-still-losing-money-on-every-one


aking a PS3 today costs Sony less than half (http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/dec2008/tc20081222_257990.htm?chan=top+news_top+news+index +-+temp_technology) of what it did at launch—$445, down from $840 (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-entertainment/ps3-a-bargain-worth-840-powerful-as-a-supercomputer-215203.php). And Sony, wouldn't you know, still loses a bucketful of money on every system.
So, at launch, the PS3 cost Sony about $840 to make, according to iSuppli, and they sold them for $599, resulting in a tidy loss of $200 a pop. By stripping out over 1200 parts and features like PS2 backward-compatibility, Sony has cut their costs to just $445 per PlayStation 3. Which they sell for 400 bucks, meaning they still lose about $45 a system.
That, friends, is why you didn't see a cheap PS3 for Christmas, and why you won't see one until deeper into next year at the earliest, even as the Xbox 360 outsold it 3-to-1 on Black Friday (http://gizmodo.com/5100774/xbox-360-outsells-ps3-31-on-black-friday). [BusinessWeek (http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/dec2008/tc20081222_257990.htm?chan=top+news_top+news+index +-+temp_technology) via PlayStation Forums (http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=ps3&thread.id=3578425) via PS3Fanboy (http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2008/12/23/ps3-costs-53-less-to-make-now-than-at-launch/)]

[retro]

I wish someone in this thread would have provide a link to offical sales stats. :crying:

Umm, I did! Go and read my posts again ;-)

The data I posted was OFFICIAL - from trade journals, not Wikis! I also posted the links to the research companies who compile this data. Someone DID provide links to the official stats. You have to pay to view the data. Your choice whether you do or not, but don't say noone gave you the source ;-)

There's a reason the data isn't readily available all the time for free - those who publish it have to pay for it! Trade journals can afford to do this, but websites possibly can't due to limited funds.

[Barc0de]

hmm..how much? i mean i see stats at ign sometimes and they re a website

[retro]

Don't know - both want you to contact them for pricing information.

[oldengineer]

Parris,

You sound alittle bit cranky


:lol:

[Parris]

Parris,

You sound alittle bit cranky and anti microsoft in your last post? why my dear fiend?

Cranky yes, anti-Microsoft..... no!

I primarily questioned your statement that the 360 had been (and I quote) '...In terms of profit per unit it's been profitable for ages now', which I found dubious.

Microsoft Games division are relying upon after sales, peripherals and Xbox Live to generate the vast bulk of profits. I was merely saying I didn't thing the units had been profitable for 'ages', and I was expressing my concern at where you obtained the information from. Don't take it as a personal attack against you.

I remember reading this :http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/bach-xbox-will-make-a-profit-in-2008 and thinking it was amazing that the original Xbox never turned a penny until it was actually about to be scrapped. In the article, it is stated that at some point in 2008 the 360 should (will / might / is expected to) break even and then begin to generate a profit if a set of conditions applied.

Both Sony & Microsoft games divisions posted profits during 2008. Albeit, as Barc0de mentioned the PS3 is still a loss leader in terms of the cost to produce against price paid at the till. So, I was wondering what it cost Microsoft to produce the 360 against it's sales receipt if they are generating profit from a console that costs £99.00 in Zavvi? If Sony are losing money when it is a full £200 more to purchase!

In asking for links to something more official and up-to-date, it would determine exact data on the unit costs / production and sales figures for the 360. I am not keen to pay for the information, nor take it from Wiki. I also think there is a HUGE amount of misinformation on the Interweb and wondered whether there was a source that could be generally relied upon to offer up a true reflection.

Given the huge amount of crap Microsoft have had to endure with the 360 I am surprised that they have generated any unit profit on the 360 so quickly (if indeed they have).

Not cranky with you I assure you. Cranky in general ;-)

Certainly NOT anti Microsoft Xbox 360. I've owned several of the flaky fuckers since the day of launch and have finally found one that works (albeit I barely switch it on due to lack of time). Out of the people I know who have owned or still own an Xbox 360 only a couple of them have had no problems with them. The rest have had to send them back as part of the recall. Perhaps MS are making a profit because many of us have purchased multiple units? I have only ever owned 1 PS3. Guess which hardware I prefer? However, guess also who wished the 360 controller (far superior) was compatible with the PS3 AND also guess who wished the PS3 had as many titles available ,and of the quality that the 360 enjoys!

[Alchy]

I'm going to end up sounding a little cranky myself now, but in the time it took you to write that rather lengthy post you could've gone to wikipedia, found the references, and made your own mind up. I just did a quick google search and found Microsoft were making a profit from some time in 2006. Go look.

[Parris]

I'm going to end up sounding a little cranky myself now, but in the time it took you to write that rather lengthy post you could've gone to wikipedia, found the references, and made your own mind up. I just did a quick google search and found Microsoft were making a profit from some time in 2006. Go look.

Then why did Robbie Bach suggest that they wouldn't until some point in 2008? You'd have thought the President of Microsoft's Entertainment division would have been a pretty good bet?

Quote from article:

"Microsoft entertainment boss (Bach) says console business about to break even. The president of Microsoft's entertainment and devices division has said he expects the company's console business to finally start making money next year (2008)"

Have a look at the link I posted. Hence me suggesting perhaps there is a bit of misinformation about it on the Internet. Not sure which sources to believe - actually I no longer care!

'Tis the season of good will, so Merry Christmas! <Off to NOT be cranky>

[Alchy]

Then why did Robbie Bach suggest that they wouldn't until some point in 2008? You'd have thought the President of Microsoft's Entertainment division would have been a pretty good bet?

Quote from article:

"Microsoft entertainment boss (Bach) says console business about to break even. The president of Microsoft's entertainment and devices division has said he expects the company's console business to finally start making money next year (2008)"

Have a look at the link I posted. Hence me suggesting perhaps there is a bit of misinformation about it on the Internet. Not sure which sources to believe - actually I no longer care!
In terms of profit for the gaming division as a whole, sure. In terms of profit per unit it's been profitable for ages now.
Last I checked both Microsoft and Sony were making a small sum on each console sold.I feel I've been pretty clear from the start. It's unlike you to miss the point, so I'll put it down to the Christmas booze ;)

[Parris]

I feel I've been pretty clear from the start. It's unlike you to miss the point, so I'll put it down to the Christmas booze ;)

And I'll put it down to not reading what other people are posting.

The Xbox 360 came out when?

It was 2005. You then posted that you had references stating that they were turning a profit by 2006. Indeed this source suggests you are correct: http://www.techspot.com/news/23612-microsoft-makes-tiny-profit-on-xbox-360-hardware.html

Or was this article just spin created by the announcement made by Microsoft in 2005 that the Xbox 360 WOULD be profitable in 2006? http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20051228-5862.html

Sometimes I'm not sure what is spin or fact?

I posted that Robbie Bach suggested that Xbox gaming division would be profitable in 2008. That's 2 years after your apparent reference, and 3 years after Microsoft themselves suggested it would be!

I then posted that Sony gaming division would also be turning a profit in 2008.

Barc0de suggested that recent sources suggested that Sony were still losing money on each PS3 sold to date. Which might be why this thread was created in the first place. I.e. that Microsoft could produce (and apparently profit from) a console costing a shit load less than the PS3, which was leaking like a sieve.

I have continually asked, when did the Xbox 360 (as a unit) turn a profit)) as I am simply surprised that Microsoft allegedly have, what with the huge recall of RROD and other faulty, cheap Chinese produced 360 consoles.

They plugged $1billion into that recall as far as I recall, so turning that into any kind of profit per unit was a huge uphill struggle. I am dubious that they have, but willing to believe it if I can see something official (that I don't have to pay for) given that the original Xbox didn't make any profit for almost it's entire lifespan.

Not missing anything and not on booze. I keep asking the same question, yet you keep throwing 'go find your own sources' at me.

I looked and found Robbie Bach (who better?) who appears to convey that the source you posted that Xbox have turned a profit from 2006 as incorrect, and given that it is still 2008 I can't see why you keep stating that the Xbox 360 has been profitable for ages, when it must be some point this year.

Any idea when?

This isn't a personal attack mate, it's a completely clear cut case of us being offered different information from different sources, one of which allegedly comes from the mouth of the President of Microsoft Games Division.

If nothing else it proves that information on the Internet can be misleading or misunderstood, especially as various sources grasp figures punted out by the manufacturers and come to a variety of conclusions that then become entangled in the opinion of the journalist or organisation. It looks to me as if the $1billion hit that Microsoft took on the 360 must have had a massive impact on the unit's profitability, which is a corner it may have turned. Does that make sense? Alcohol or not?

There was a great cartoon a few weeks ago that I saw. It read 'I can't come to bed right now honey, someone on the Internet is WRONG!' I am prepared to believe it could be me Alchy. I am just wondering where to go for the best information on this subject as I don't work in the industry. A novice at the helm here!

[PhreQuencYViii]

Good god Parris, have you ever written a book? lol

[Parris]

Good god Parris, have you ever written a book? lol

First rule in engagement, if you can't win, fight harder! lol ;-)

[Alchy]

I can't see why you keep stating that the Xbox 360 has been profitable for ages, when it must be some point this year.This is the last time I'm going to say this. I was talking about Microsoft making a profit per unit sold and not a profit over the entire division. There's really no way I can simplify this any further. I know you can appreciate this distinction so I'm at a loss as to why we've had this back-and-forth over so many posts.

[Parris]

Clearly I do write too many words, so many that you don't bother reading them. Go back, have look (if you can be arsed), if you find what I have written re per unit, then come back and answer the one question I had. If not, then don't worry, it's really not all that important to either of us :banghead:

[Alchy]

Well, touché. You responded to all my (very clearly noted) claims about profitability per unit with general claims of Microsofts Xbox division's profitability. I don't think there's anything more to it than that. Go back and re-read it if you like.

[Christer-swe]

You go read my posts..!

No, you go read my posts!

No, you should read my posts!
:lol:

[graciano1337]

^^ LOL

PS awesome avatar btw.

[Parris]

Well, touché. You responded to all my (very clearly noted) claims about profitability per unit with general claims of Microsofts Xbox division's profitability. I don't think there's anything more to it than that. Go back and re-read it if you like.

LOL - I questioned them! That's all there is to it... fuck what we wrote!

Let's just forget it eh, I think we both need a little sherry and a mincemeat pie! ;-)

Merry Christmas everyone and BACK ON TOPIC!!! YAY!!!!

[Unorthodox]

http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii211/Unorthodoxic/Newcopy.jpg

My dog won the console race. The war is over. We can now carry on with our lives without worrying about sales figures. Hurray!

[Alchy]

Let's just forget it eh, I think we both need a little sherry and a mincemeat pie! ;-)

Merry Christmas everyone and BACK ON TOPIC!!! YAY!!!!Amen to that! And Merry Christmas all. Doubt I'll be on now until the inevitable boxing day hangover, so hope you all have a good one.

[retro]

Parris,

You sound alittle bit cranky and anti microsoft in your last post? why my dear fiend?

Cranky yes, anti-Microsoft..... no!

......

Not cranky with you I assure you. Cranky in general ;-)

At least he got the fiend bit right!! :lol:

I believe you mean this:

http://img383.imageshack.us/img383/4122/dutycallset4.png

I am beginning to think this thread is going to outlive the PS3! :crying:

[Jamtex]

Piffle the Playstation 3 is doing well and as long as it outsells the Xbox 360 in Japan and third parties sell more games on the Playstation then it will be here for a long time to come.

[rupert]

I love my PS3, I only bought it a month ago and can't fault it at all. Hopfully my GF will have got me some games for Xmas as I've completed all the ones I got with it.

I predict it will die when the 360 die's, when the next gen comes along. Unlike the PS2 which hasnt quite died even yet. maybe the wii will live on a little like the ps2 did last gen.

[andoba]

I have a PS3 and if it did crash, I wouldn't mind that much. I would be able finally to pick up all the games I want to play, because the games at the shops are all 69.95€ or 59.95€, I don't like any of the platinum games and I only find shitty second hand games. If it crashes, shops will start to clean off PS3 games quick so, I guess they would lower the prices a lot. :D

[zappenduster]

for me the ps3 feels like a neogeo all again too expensive for the massmarket

[rupert]

I love my PS3, I only bought it a month ago and can't fault it at all. Hopfully my GF will have got me some games for Xmas as I've completed all the ones I got with it.



Well she got me Burnout Paradise, Bioshock, Fallout 3, GTA IV and Dirt so that should keep me going until my birthday in June :dance:

[c_rpg]

You're forgetting the fact that there's lots of ignorant retards here in Europe who still think all consoles are called a Playstation and have never even heard of a Wii or a 360. Playstation has made its mark here in the 90's and it's very unlikely it will go away all of a sudden.

Think about it. The PS3 is the most popular console right here. Parents even buy there 8 year olds a PS3 in stead of a Wii just because they think it's the only real console on the market.

There's something horribly wrong with the way people think over here...

[Christer-swe]

Think about it. The PS3 is the most popular console right here. Parents even buy there 8 year olds a PS3 in stead of a Wii just because they think it's the only real console on the market.

I doubt that tiny minority has a real impact on the market. But I'd love to see proof to prove me wrong. Otherwise you might not want to generalize your experience on all of Europe. :thumbsup:

[Giel]

for me the ps3 feels like a neogeo all again too expensive for the massmarket
Last time I checked, you can get a PS3 for ~300 euro right now? A Wii is 250 and it's the console every and their mom can afford so I doubt the PS3 is too expensive. It still has an expensive feeling for some reason though.

[zappenduster]

Last time I checked, you can get a PS3 for ~300 euro right now? A Wii is 250 and it's the console every and their mom can afford so I doubt the PS3 is too expensive. It still has an expensive feeling for some reason though.

for me the prices where 399 eu for the ps3 and 200 for a 360 thats nearly neogeo stage in germany

[andoba]

Last time I checked, you can get a PS3 for ~300 euro right now? A Wii is 250 and it's the console every and their mom can afford so I doubt the PS3 is too expensive. It still has an expensive feeling for some reason though.

The ones I've seen in my city go from 319€ (cheapest) to 599€ (most expensive).

[Taucias]

Quite. The Wii has TRUE support, and is superb. Microsoft haven't released an update in a year, which is disappointing, but there are still almost 500 games that are compatible, basically half of the Xbox library. The REALLY impressive thing is that an unreleased game is on the list!!!

Hard to screw up emulation when you're running a faster version of the exact same hardware though :lol:

Unrelated to the above quote: The PS3 will be profitable this coming quarter (by the end of the fiscal year) thanks to RSX die reduction down to 65nm (this month the first chips rolled off production).

We'll probably see another price cut within a couple of months.

[Parris]

I miss having backwards compatibility on the 360 in full, really pleased the Wii allows it and utterly pissed off that the PS3 doesn't have atleast PS2 bc. Sigh!

[Christer-swe]

Last time I checked, you can get a PS3 for ~300 euro right now? A Wii is 250 and it's the console every and their mom can afford so I doubt the PS3 is too expensive. It still has an expensive feeling for some reason though.

I haven't seen a PS3 for under €440 in stores. While 360's go for €170 and a Wii for €200.

[MottZilla]

I miss having backwards compatibility on the 360 in full, really pleased the Wii allows it and utterly pissed off that the PS3 doesn't have atleast PS2 bc. Sigh!

What do you mean "doesn't have atleast"? All PS3s run PS1 games. So how is it atleast? There's still the chance all PS3s will get PS2 support via software emulation in the future. But personally I don't see why it's a big deal. It's better to play on the original system as other than GBC and Wii, most backwards compatibility has noticable flaws. There are PS1 games I have that don't work right on PS2.

[Parris]

What do you mean "doesn't have atleast"? All PS3s run PS1 games. So how is it atleast? There's still the chance all PS3s will get PS2 support via software emulation in the future. But personally I don't see why it's a big deal. It's better to play on the original system as other than GBC and Wii, most backwards compatibility has noticable flaws. There are PS1 games I have that don't work right on PS2.

Sorry, badly written sentence. I had a Japanese PS3, which I sold to obtain a UK PS3 (wished I hadn't). I meant that of all the features removed, the one I would wish had not been was PS2 compatibility. I do miss it as I would like to be able to get rid of the PS2 from the TV stand. Just my personal opinion on bc. Less clutter. Same as with owning a Naomi 2 motherboard that is capable of playing N1 titles as it means I can leave the one device in the cabinet. Ergo, bc on the PS3 would have been equally useful.

However, have you attempted to play PS1 titles on the PS3? Ouch, the graphics look awful! So really at the moment I prefer to have a PS1 in the cabinet as well... double sigh!

[sh3-rg]

I don't like any of the platinum games and I only find shitty second hand games.

Really? I'd recommend Oblivion GOTY & Drake's Fortune - two games I think everyone should give a go. There's loads of cheap games for ps360 at amazon & play etc. Recently I've had the above two, Orange box £15, Lego Batman £17, LittleBigPlanet £16, Assasins Creed £10 - all plenty of game for the money. The new Tomb Raider was £18 recently but I passed on that one. I got Fallout 3 for Christmas so obviously none of those games above are going to get a look in for months.

As for on-topic: PS3 death clock?! haha, I think someone wanted to out this forum's fanboys or woke up with a touch for fanboymanflu (there's a lot of it going around). As for suggesting an arbitrary months left until death figure for any console - what's the point, really? The world is in such a fucked up state financially that even people who are supposed to know/care about stuff like that are not going to have the beginnings of a clue & probably have far more important things to worry about.

x360 has red rings, ps3 no games & wii is for 5 year olds/the mentally challenged, therefore playing games this generation is a waste of money/effort/life. They're all doomed & will be 3do'd in due course.

Back to sleep...

[PhreQuencYViii]

What do you mean "doesn't have atleast"? All PS3s run PS1 games. So how is it atleast? There's still the chance all PS3s will get PS2 support via software emulation in the future. But personally I don't see why it's a big deal. It's better to play on the original system as other than GBC and Wii, most backwards compatibility has noticable flaws. There are PS1 games I have that don't work right on PS2.

Well, I like BC because then I don't have to have so much hooked up. I figured PS3 BC would help me play PS2/PS1 better on my HDTV. When it works, the 360 does a great job with it's BC, and looks/shows up better through HDMI vs. an old Xbox hooked up over component.

[graciano1337]

x360 has red rings, ps3 no games & wii is for 5 year olds/the mentally challenged, therefore playing games this generation is a waste of money/effort/life. They're all doomed & will be 3do'd in due course.

Back to sleep...


geez... harsh...

[limey]

I meant that of all the features removed, the one I would wish had not been was PS2 compatibility. I do miss it as I would like to be able to get rid of the PS2 from the TV stand. Just my personal opinion on bc. Less clutter. Absolutely. Watering down the PS3->PS2 BC was the one action that I personally disliked the most. Having said that, since my 60Gb US unit is now going to be difficult to replace like-with-like, I rarely use the bc capability, as I'd prefer to wear out a much easier to replace PS2 for this. Such is life. Pulling the bc, along with other cost reductions in the board/IC design has allowed Sony to save money & get closer to a more competitive pricing point, in what are turning out to be far more interesting times that anyone was prediciting a year or 2 ago.

Could they have saved more by pulling the multimedia capabilies? Well, with the initial cost of BluRay drives, yes/maybe. However, Sony's had a strategy of trying to make their consoles entertainment hubs since PS2 (with DVD thrown in) & I know plenty of folks for which the BluRay was a factor in their purchasing choice.


As for on-topic: PS3 death clock?! haha, I think someone wanted to out this forum's fanboys or woke up with a touch for fanboymanflu (there's a lot of it going around). As for suggesting an arbitrary months left until death figure for any console - what's the point, really? The world is in such a fucked up state financially that even people who are supposed to know/care about stuff like that are not going to have the beginnings of a clue & probably have far more important things to worry about.Amen, brother! Couldn't have put it better myself.

[Alchy]

x360 has red rings, ps3 no games & wii is for 5 year olds/the mentally challenged, therefore playing games this generation is a waste of money/effort/life. They're all doomed & will be 3do'd in due course.

Back to sleep...geez... harsh...You do realise he was taking the piss, yes?

[Taucias]

I miss having backwards compatibility on the 360 in full, really pleased the Wii allows it and utterly pissed off that the PS3 doesn't have atleast PS2 bc. Sigh!

Shouldn't have cheaped out. My PS3 is almost 100% compatible ;-)

Unrelated to above: The PS3 was selling more than the XB360 prior to the price drop. Once Sony drop the price (~$300) it will ramp up sales again. This generation is price sensitive due to the high price of all consoles this time around combined with the economy.

Plus most of the great games that have been shown are hitting the shelves now or during 2009.

[wildcat]

retro,

I did miss the stats you had provided earlier on, sorry about that!

Most likely cause I quickly scanned this thread, I usual don't have much time on my hands. I'am not familar with NPD marketing corporation either. Whatever the case your post was bang on in this thread.

Barcode,

Thanks for your post with stats, nice post!

Parris,

I just thought you were being anti microsoft thats all.

Microsoft beat sony with ease sales wise! and than put out 2 more consoles to consolidate a better position in the market and there still holding the best fps console position that exist.

[retro]

retro,

I did miss the stats you had provided earlier on, sorry about that!

Most likely cause I quickly scanned this thread, I usual don't have much time on my hands. I'am not familar with NPD marketing corporation either. Whatever the case your post was bang on in this thread.

No worries! It's easy to do.

I'd be interested to know if anyone does chase up the stats thing as to how much it might cost. There's a possibility I'd get it in the future for a site I'd be running.

[Taucias]

80GB PS3 is now 300 Euros with 300 Blu-Ray movie in Belgium:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=346430

[randyrandall]

Playstation has made its mark here in the 90's and it's very unlikely it will go away all of a sudden.

There's something horribly wrong with the way people think over here... Are you including England in your sweeping statement? It seems the majority of people I know have an Xbox 360 and are very pleased with it- those who don't have one are envious and/or plan to get one. The only reason people have a PS3 seems to be due to 'hardcore' brand loyalty (e.g Playstation is better than Xbox because of X and X etc etc) who don't seem subject to reason or logic.

The 360 is the default 'cool' choice amongst teenagers in my view. The PS3 seems to be regarded as nonessential, apart from for the 'hardcore'/dedicated.

[rupert]

Are you including England in your sweeping statement? It seems the majority of people I know have an Xbox 360 and are very pleased with it- those who don't have one are envious and/or plan to get one. The only reason people have a PS3 seems to be due to 'hardcore' brand loyalty (e.g Playstation is better than Xbox because of X and X etc etc) who don't seem subject to reason or logic.

The 360 is the default 'cool' choice amongst teenagers in my view. The PS3 seems to be regarded as nonessential, apart from for the 'hardcore'/dedicated.

I disagree, I and the people I know who have bought PS3's have done so because they are a quality item. The 360 is cheap feeling and breaks down. I don't get all this talk of it having no games either, I have 7 great games for mine which should last me through to June I'm guessing (I'd say I spend maybe 8 - 10 hours per week gaming). I see it doesnt have as many games as the 360 but it doesnt really matter as i'm not going to play through the entire catalogue of games available.

anyway, the PS3 is not doing badly and is not going to die soon so get over it and just be happy with your 360's (there a nice little system when they work ;-) )

goes to dust off his flame cloak

[wildcat]

retro,

Don't you think the nonpaying ones are any good for stats? why pay for something that is free?


The other thing I have found is the paying ones are not always that good.
I have heard bad advice has been given by some of these marketing firms from people who own businesses. I would only treat stats as a guide line not the be all end all.

[andoba]

80GB PS3 is now 300 Euros with 300 Blu-Ray movie in Belgium:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=346430

HOLY SHIT, I though that it came with three hundred movies! XDDD

[GaijinPunch]

I think it's hilarious that there's an 8-page thread stating the PS3 will be dead in less than a year and a half. The DC lasted way longer, sold way less, and CSK had way less money than Sony. This is a joke, right?

[Slade Rahl]

It just shows peoples bias toward Sony right now. I wish another company would come along that people can bitch about. I'm not a staunch defender in Sony by any means, but I am a fan. I admit where they have faults, but to say that the PS3 is horrible and it's going to die within a year blah blah blah...bullshit.

[retro]

PS3s haven't had great reliability either though, mate ;) I am qualifying this statement from having worked in retail and dealt with issues, returns and talking to the Sony UK distributors on a daily basis, not "well, me and a coupla mates are fine". Incidentally, I've had my 360 for two years and it's still running fine.

The PS3 has some good games. Unfortunately, a lot of them are on 360, too. The PS3 has very few good EXCLUSIVE games, I think that's the point.

It is all down to personal opinion. You've given yours, respect to that. In my personal opinion, the PS3 is not a quality item at all. The 360 looks and feels much better, too. Oh, and it who says the RROD is a bad thing? The 360 now has a longer warranty ;-) lol. I can replace mine tomorrow if it dies. Had I bought a PS3 two years ago and it overheated, should I be saying, "Oh well, time to buy a new one"? FUCK THAT! I'd be saying, "Oh my God, what an overpriced piece of shit! And Sony don't care, the money-grabbing bastards!"

[Slade Rahl]

Never have had one issue with my 80GB PS3...it's tip top. I think people just need to take better care of their machines. I remember there were issues people had with PS2's stop working. I still have mine to this day (almost 8 years) and it runs perfect. I actually take care of my machines (dust them off occasionally basically) and have had no issues.

[PhreQuencYViii]

It kind of sucks money and sales are what matter the most...Dreamcast died and was way fucking better then the PS2 up till it died, but noooo....

[Tachikoma]

The PS3 has very few good EXCLUSIVE games, I think that's the point.

LBP
flOw
MGS4
Wipeout
Tekken
Uncharted
Super Stardust HD
Echochrome
PixelJunk Eden
Valkyria Chronicles
FFXIII (when it's eventually out)
Folklore
Eye of Judgement
Hot Shots Golf
GT5
Killzone
Resistance:FOM
Ratchet & Clank

That's just the cream of the crop, and like you said, there's tons of cross platform games, even though I also have a 360, that's not the first platform I choose a cross platform game on. I couldn't give a shit about online FPS games, so would rather pick the console the pad fits better with and doesn't need my TV turned up to 14 to be able to hear anything.

[PhreQuencYViii]

Tekken
FFXIII (when it's eventually out)

...doesn't need my TV turned up to 14 to be able to hear anything.

I'm just being a dick but those two aren't exclusive....nitpicky, I know, lol.

And the last one, huh? What do you mean?

[Slade Rahl]

Well the PS3 is getting Versus XIII exclusive...and honestly I'd rather play that one over regular XIII anyhow (but, admittedly I'm getting both)

And I'm not sure about the volume thing either...my friend's 360 doesn't do that, maybe it's just your TV?

I know my PS3 always plays my audio files REALLY loud compared to what the TV setting is....not complaining, it's good quality, just a bit shocking when I have the volume on 15 so as not to wake my neighbors and it comes blaring out like it's on 50 haha. Only for music though.

Yeah, the XBOX exclusives I've seen really don't appeal to me like the PS3 ones do...I enjoyed Fable 1, but pfft...just one game.

[PhreQuencYViii]

I just hope they don't have ass the 360 port of FF13 (if it's even a good game...RPG's seem to suck now). Same with if MGS4 every comes out for 360. I can see them being better in some ways and worse in others, but if a game is really designed for one system it's usually better on that, I just would rather play stuff on the 360 myself.

What's FF13 Versus? I was under the impression it was a side game or something. Google time I guess.

If your looking forward to FF13, Lost Odyssey is pretty kick ass!

[retro]

retro,

Don't you think the nonpaying ones are any good for stats? why pay for something that is free?

The only way to get accurate charts is to pay. Someone has to compile data - do you think that's done for free? If someone chooses to buy that data and release it for free (offsetting the cost in another way e.g. advertising) that's up to them. It was still paid for! What I'm saying is that, if you're in a position of authority (e.g. a magazine) then you'll have charts with a little footnote as to where they came from. Watch the news, you'll see that when they give stats (e.g. unemployment is up 50%) it'll say something like (data compiled by GfK). You don't print a chart saying - data plucked out of my arse.


HOLY SHIT, I though that it came with three hundred movies! XDDD

Deliberate selling tactic ;-) haha!


Never have had one issue with my 80GB PS3...it's tip top. I think people just need to take better care of their machines.

PRECISELY what I said about my 360! It works both ways.


I know my PS3 always plays my audio files REALLY loud compared to what the TV setting is....not complaining, it's good quality, just a bit shocking when I have the volume on 15 so as not to wake my neighbors and it comes blaring out like it's on 50 haha. Only for music though.

Shame you don't have a 360, then! The dashboard has a volume control exclusively for music ;-) I'd be very surprised if the PS3 doesn't, too.

Tachikoma, congratulations on producing a list of which only one game would make me consider buying the platform - GT5. Resistance was (IMHO) shite - too many explosions and you couldn't see what was going on. And the pad SUCKS - I find it really uncomfortable so it isn't good for an FPS for me. So cross off FPS - the 360 does it better. LittleBigPlanet is great fun with friends, but I don't think it is enough to make me want to buy the system. Sure, if I had one I'd probably get it. Final Fantasy? Hope it isn't going to be like 12 or I'll be bored shitless. I'm getting tired of the series now. Tekken sucks balls. I am not a huge fighting fan. I loved SF2 but Tekken is just too complex. Metal Gear is getting a bit stale. Eye of Judgement sat on our shelf for months because it is so DIRE. Um, Ratchet and Clank? Really? I'm not 12. That series does nothing for me. I liked Motorstorm. I liked the F1 game that came out on release. Shame they weren't on your list ;-) There just aren't enough decent stand-out exclusive titles for me.

I would never buy a game for the PS3 over the 360, were I to have the choice. I like playing with my friends online - and most of them have a 360 as opposed to 3 who still have a PS3. Those who had a PS3 and sold them kept their 360. As I said before, I can't stand the pad - it feels like cheap crap. It is too light and it doesn't fit the hand well. And the last minute motion sensor is a joke.

As for your sound point, might I suggest investing in a new TV? I have to turn my sound DOWN to play my Xbox - it is so much louder than my Freeview or any other input!

[PhreQuencYViii]

Resistance was (IMHO) shite - too many explosions and you couldn't see what was going on.

Oh god, thats how fucking Lost Planet was. Pissed me off.

I like the 360 as a media center, but I wish it supported more files. The PS3 you can throw Linux on it but thats stupid, they should support shit like FLAC and MKV's. 360 can do WMA Lossless streaming which is cool but maybe I don't want to use that.

[Unorthodox]

Here's my 2 cents for all it's worth.


PS3 > 360 build quality. When I first unboxed my 360 I couldn't get over how cheap and plasticy it felt.
360 > PS3 pad. I love the 360 pad, so comfortable, I could hold it for hours :).
PS3 > 360 in exclusive games. Maybe it's just me but aside from Gears, Blue Dragon and Braid (which are all fantastic games I may add), there seems a void of exclusives. Were as the PS3 has MGS4, LBP, Heavenly Sword, Uncharted, Valkyria Chronicles, Ratchet and Clank etc and tons of original PSN games.
360 ≈ PS3 regarding being media centres. 360 has better organisation for an audio library, PS3 of course has blu-ray, 360 has netflicks (at least in the US), PS3 is nice and quiet, 360 is loud! and so on.
360 > PS3 for online, but for what I want out of an online experience the PS3 does me fine for free. I know what games my friends are playing, I can message and chat to them, that's enough for me.
360 > PS3 for price, but I got my PS3 for free :P. But things to consider are the ease of upgrading the HDD and the fact that it's a great blu-ray player. However if you're interested purely in gaming and nothing else, 360 gets you more bang for buck, just be sure to keep your receipt.

[graciano1337]

You don't even need your receipt. Just call Microsoft and say, "Hey. New Xbox. Now!" :)

[Unorthodox]

You don't even need your receipt. Just call Microsoft and say, "Hey. New Xbox. Now!" :)

Hmm a friend done that and they said "Hey. No way. Not without a receipt" :-/

[PhreQuencYViii]

Microsoft doesn't care if you have a reciept. You just have to register your console.

I don't get why they don't just toch all the old motherboards and give everyone jaspers. Wouldn't that end up saving them money in the long run?

[randyrandall]

Xbox 360? Plastic and cheap feeling? It's got a metal case..? I think it feels really solid, and no more 'cheap' feeling than any other games console.

The games library is intense on the 360- a huge selection of top titles that can be had for next to no money whatsoever. The controller is a dream- the most comfy controller ever, next to the Gamecube. The whole 360 experience is fantastic, and as a new owner, I have been impressed through and through.

The PS3 strikes me as having few exclusives worth my attention, and the controller is nearly exactly the same as from 1996- it was a slapdash design then and its a slapdash design now.

I'd need someone to verify this, but I believe the PS3 can only display in 50hz on SDTVs which is a serious influencing factor on my purchase. Can anyone verify this?

However, there is no way - no way - the PS3 will 'die'. It may 'finish' in third, but its obviously going to have a huge cult following from those loyal to the Playstation brand, and, as mentioned, those who believe it is a quality, luxury item above the 360. I just hope Sony will learn from these mistakes and listen to the complaints of the people who know best, the gamers.

[PhreQuencYViii]

I miss the old Xbox design, lol. I think one reason the 360 was made to look the way it is is because people LAN it up with them. At least it's easy to carry.

[wildcat]

Ok retro,

But just cause you pay for such stats doesn't mean there going to be accurate do to lack of skill by employees. I see quite a few dummies who say they work for a living but they can't even make my coffee properly!

I have also used goverment stats which in some cases I know are warped. The goverment pays alot money to have those stats made, yet some of there findings are still laughable.

Ah retro,
The stat you got, weren't from NPN were they? were did you get them from?


Also Parris,

Where did you get this 1 billon xbox 360 recall from?

and by the way Parris your post aren't too long I appreciate the content of most of your post and threads. THANKS! :icon_bigg :icon_bigg :icon_bigg

[Tachikoma]

I mean you have to turn the TV up to be able to hear the game over the fucking drone of the 360 drive and fans. I swear, the Dreamcast was quieter than the 360.

So, let me get this straight Retro my lovely, you don't like the PS3 exclusive games, so therefore there are "no games"? I think you mean:

"IMHO there are no games on the PS3 for me"

Opinion, not fact. Plenty of people have and enjoy the PS3, as I have said before, if someone doesn't like "Console X" and thinks "Console Y" is better, just let them enjoy it. FFS.

[PhreQuencYViii]

Hard drive installs help with the noise by far, but yeah, it is fucking noisy. I remember when I first hooked it up. I thought it was busted. Same with DC, lol.

[Parris]

Parris,

Where did you get this 1 billon xbox 360 recall from?

and by the way Parris your post aren't too long I appreciate the content of most of your post and threads. THANKS! :icon_bigg :icon_bigg :icon_bigg

It was well documented that Microsoft allocated $1billion to the recall of the Xbox 360, however this was a figure posted PRIOR to the recall being put into practice and as such I suspect that this is an approximation. I am not sure how much it would cost per unit to ship, replace parts, package up, cost of reshipping and additional cost of customer care staff time. I have returned 7 out of 8 machines! I'm now on my 9th. One had it's warranty sticker peeled off so couldn't go back :-(

Here is one such post re the $1billion claim: http://blogs.zdnet.com/hardware/?p=590 (which in itself continues the Xbox 360 profitability speculation, but we shall NOT go there lol)

There is a second hand shop along the road from me that returns on average 15-20 units per month. I know the manager. The local independent retailer in the centre of town has a WALL of fucked Xbox 360s - I literally mean 1 solid wall of units he has accumulated over 8 or 9 months. They no longer repair faulty units or buy them in. They return them on behalf of customers or get customers to do it themselves. I dread to think of what the recall has actually cost and / or what percentage of the early units were actually faulty.

Microsoft are very guarded (like all manufacturers) about the exact number of units returned and the genuine cost of the recall. When I worked in retail there was a particular manufacturer (whom I shall not name for legal reasons) that all staff joked about. We had an incredibly high return on their units due to poor manufacture. Each week we'd send a pallet of damaged / faulty stock back to the central depot and we could guarantee that the bulk of those units belonged to a specific company. We were almost right every week, plus we knew the most unreliable of the company's stock list and avoided offering them to customers we knew. We really should have considered dropping them, but we made a lot of money from each unit due to low cost price.

Again, I would like to see something more official, however this was the initial figure released by Microsoft to the press. I would imagine that genuine details would be rather embarrassing and sensitive to their current sales position.

As for length of post. I appreciate that someone takes the time out to read through my piffle! I like it when someone more direct comes on and encapsulates precisely what I was trying to say in like 1 sentence! I take 30 paragraphs to arrive at the same conclusion lol. :oh:

[GaijinPunch]

Does anyone else feel that comparing the PS3 to the 360 is like comparing dog shit to horse shit?

[Unorthodox]

Does anyone else feel that comparing the PS3 to the 360 is like comparing dog shit to horse shit?

OMG UR SUCH A DOG SHIT FANBOI!

HORSE SHIT PWNS UR DOG SHIT!

Also my horse shit has exclusive content and horse fly's!

[PhreQuencYViii]

Does anyone else feel that comparing the PS3 to the 360 is like comparing dog shit to horse shit?

Stop being old!!!! lol.

And I love that avatar Unorthodox.

[sh3-rg]

Does anyone else feel that comparing the PS3 to the 360 is like comparing dog shit to horse shit?
Yes, Nintendo! They're laughing their tits off while the 'big two' fight for a distant second. For me, the ps360 bickering beats even the 'good old' Amiga vs ST wars. Not a perfect comparison, fair enough, but often as dirty & surely just as pointless. You pay your money, you take your choice. Apples & yet more apples. Horses fuck horses (that's how we get little horses). Can't think of a completely suitable cliché right now.

A lot of the old arguments should have passed to the great flame war in the skies, but still they're regularly regurgitated almost by instinct down in the trenches of the fanboy front line. I think much has changed in recent times to level the playing field between the two consoles. Pricing is probably the only important difference to most people along with the influence of friends & family.

Neither Microsoft nor Sony will come out of this generation without having learned a harsh lesson or two, but neither company is about to '3do' or exit stage right Sega fashion. Microsoft can afford to do what they like to ensure more & more people see them as the rightful owners of that important little space under the TV, but Sony seem determined to fight them for it... and all the while Nintendo seems to be showing them both that the average person is still quite happy to have an affordable console for simply playing games while they do their other shit with computers & dedicated players.

But then forums such as this are rarely frequented by today's average gamer (if I even know what an average gamer is these days). It's interesting in a way (ok, probably not that interesting, but hey-ho). Around 13 years or so ago Sony started what Sega & Nintendo were in no danger of doing any time soon by turning gaming mainstream. PlayStation became the generic term for games console & it wasn't just kids stuff any more. Most Sega & Nintendo fans would tell you Sony had brought about a new chavvy, casual era in gaming. Fast forward a few years & Sega can't compete but Nintendo manage to steady the ship (with huge thanks to Pokemon). Then in similar fashion to Sony's arrival, Microsoft enter the arena & help push the gaming experience forward. And now here's the seemingly under-powered Nintendo Wii - many people's vote for a good 2nd console. If PlayStation had brought gaming to a new audience, Nintendo's Wii has somehow slipped in via the back door & made just as big moves into a wider market. Girl-friendly gaming. Granny-friendly gaming! Who could have foreseen that after the mediocre performance of the gamecube? It was brave of Nintendo to take the path to where they are now, they might have lost a few of the old guard, but they've more than made up for it.

Over the next few years I can see all 3 consoles doing enough. 360 should easily manage to stay ahead of ps3 due to it's head start & pricing. With a substantial price cut ps3 should attract more of the chavvy/yoof types ps & ps2 once attracted before the 360 became their default machine, without that it's going to be slow progress. Wii is an odd one, I wonder where that kind of market will peak? Not much way to tell. There's a lot of machines out there, but I can't help feeling a good number of those owners have really small libraries of games - that's just pure speculation, though.

Back to the original question. I find horse shit does wonders for the roses, while dog shit tends to just stink up the place with no real benefit, so I think the comparison is unfair. Although Wii could be a sneakly little burried cat turd that Sony & Microsoft thought nothing of until they went out to do a bit of gardening and ended up with stinky fingers. Bah, it's getting late, I'll get me coat.

[Slade Rahl]

The PS3 has volume control for music too...if I failed to mention it, the sound quality is actually VERY GOOD. It just starts off louder than other things in the system. Even coming out of SDTV speakers the sound quality is amazing. So I'm not faulting the PS3 on it's sound output at all, it's actually commendable.

[rupert]

There's a lot of machines out there, but I can't help feeling a good number of those owners have really small libraries of games - that's just pure speculation, though.



Well you would think that but (and I know this is only one small example) My dad hasnt bought a gaming machine since the Vic20 (or maybe Spectrum) but I went round the other day and noticed a Wii under the telly.. I was like 'wow, when did you get that!?', he had had it for a few months. I asked what he had for it and he reached down the side of the sofa and started pulling out piles of games, he had like 20+ (mainly good) games. I have new found respect for my father.

[c_rpg]

In this case I wouldn't judge Europe as a minority because if you check out the overall sales numbers the difference between the number of sold PS3's is actually almost in Europe's favor.

<table class="wikitable" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0.5em 1em; float: right;" align="center" border="1"><tbody><tr><td style="background: rgb(242, 242, 242) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; text-align: right;">Canada</td> <td>520,000 as of August 1, 2008<sup id="cite_ref-canadianpress_63-0" class="reference">[/URL]</sup></td> <td>November 17, 2006</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="background: rgb(242, 242, 242) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; text-align: right;">Europe</td> <td>5 million as of May 6, 2008<sup id="cite_ref-PS3EuropeSales_64-0" class="reference"> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ps3#cite_note-canadianpress-63)</sup></td> <td>March 23, 2007</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="background: rgb(242, 242, 242) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; text-align: right;">Japan</td> <td>2,369,484 as of October 1, 2008<sup id="cite_ref-Japansales_65-0" class="reference"></sup></td> <td>November 11, 2006</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="background: rgb(242, 242, 242) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; text-align: right;">United Kingdom</td> <td>1.4 million as of September 2008<sup id="cite_ref-UKsales_66-0" class="reference"> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ps3#cite_note-Japansales-65)</sup></td> <td>March 23, 2007</td> </tr> <tr> <td style="background: rgb(242, 242, 242) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; text-align: right;">United States</td> <td>5.7 million as of November 1, 2008<sup id="cite_ref-USsales_67-0" class="reference">[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ps3#cite_note-USsales-67"]</sup></td> <td>November 17, 2006</td></tr></tbody></table>






If you combine Europe and the UK and compare it with the US and Canada combined, you'll see that there are actually more PS3's sold over here. So Europe definantly plays a big role in this.

And if you check again, you'll also see the PS3 was released later here and the sales figures are earlier. The total difference is 11 months for Europe compared to USA (released about 4 months later and sales figures are about 7 months earlier). That's almost an entire year! I'd like to see the recent numbers cause I'm pretty sure the difference is going to be very small.

[Christer-swe]

In this case I wouldn't judge Europe as a minority because if you check out the overall sales numbers the difference between the number of sold PS3's is actually almost in Europe's favor.

Who I mentioned as being a minority was the parents who gave their eight-year-olds a PS3 simply for thinking the Playstation was the only video games console. And as I said they didn't have a real impact on the market. Why the PS3 is doing so good is for some other reason.

Proofreading is your friend! :thumbsup:

[c_rpg]

Who I mentioned as being a minority was the parents who gave their eight-year-olds a PS3 simply for thinking the Playstation was the only video games console. And as I said they didn't have a real impact on the market. Why the PS3 is doing so good is for some other reason.

Proofreading is your friend! :thumbsup:
Off course I agree that this is not the only reason why PS3 is still doing so well in Europe.

What I meant to explain was the reason why Playstation is such a big name. All the kids I grew up with had a Playstation console, I was practically the only one who had an N64 instead.

Now all those people have grown up but that mindstead of 'the Playstation' is still there. You just notice it alot when talking about games to people on the streets.
The first thing they mention is 'the Playstation' (:pray:).

I've had conversations with people who were convinced Final Fantasy 7 was the first Final Fantasy ever. And no, they weren't retards.

[Slade Rahl]

When I was growing up, everything was "a Nintendo" even my Sega Genesis was haha....but when the Playstation came out, even my mom (who knows next to NOTHING of video games) started calling everything "Playstation" it's weird to think of.

Just like EVERY handheld game system is automatically a "Gameboy" or something...

[wildcat]

I hear ya Parris,

Microsoft admited publicly July 2007 to the 1 billon doller recall and yes I do agree that numbers would be subject sensitive. They can and have written part of that 1 billon down on there quarterly you know.

link:http: microsoft.com/Presspass/press/2007/jul07/07-05WarrantyExtentionPR.mspx?rss_fdn=Press%20Release s

What was the problem with your 360 Parris?

I don't think it gets better than this? Below

They also offer to pay for repairs or replacements and I image one most likely could get there money back. I don't think it gets better than that? :icon_bigg

I found a sale stats source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Console_wars#Canada_sales_figures

Worldwide sales figures:

Wii (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii) – 34.55 million, as of 30 September 2008 (2008 -09-30)<SUP class="plainlinks asof-tag update" style="DISPLAY: none">[update] (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Console_wars&action=edit)</SUP><SUP class=reference id=cite_ref-081030e_22-0>[23] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Console_wars#cite_note-081030e-22)</SUP>
Xbox 360 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360) – 25 million, as of 25 November 2008 (2008 -11-25)<SUP class="plainlinks asof-tag update" style="DISPLAY: none">[update] (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Console_wars&action=edit)</SUP><SUP class=reference id=cite_ref-23>[24] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Console_wars#cite_note-23)</SUP>
PlayStation 3 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3) – 16.84 million, as of 30 September 2008 (2008 -09-30)<SUP class="plainlinks asof-tag update" style="DISPLAY: none">[update] (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Console_wars&action=edit)</SUP><SUP class=reference id=cite_ref-24>[25] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Console_wars#cite_note-24)</SUP>wars#Canada_sales_figures (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Console_wars#Canada_sales_figures)

but I was wrongwikipedia.org/wiki/Console_wars#Canada_sales_figures (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Console_wars#Canada_sales_figures)


thanks for your accurate input Parris!

[grahf]

I think at this point its likely to end up like the Gamecube. Not dead, but significantly dried up towards the end. However in this case perhaps they will still get used as Bluray players. Downloadable content will help it along a bit as well.

[retro]

Ok retro,

But just cause you pay for such stats doesn't mean there going to be accurate do to lack of skill by employees. I see quite a few dummies who say they work for a living but they can't even make my coffee properly!

Quite, but these stats are produced from certain sources - for example major retailers. They use POS systems which DON'T lie. You understand what I mean? Barcode is scanned, till goes Aha! 1 more sold, that makes 29,741. That report then gets processed. So they're as accurate as they can be. It'll either be from certain large retailers or from the distributors. Both have their problems - the distributors can tell you how many units were sold TO RETAIL OUTLETS, and the retailers can tell you how many THEY sold but not how many were sold by other retailers. So yes, you have to compromise somewhere. If you would like to run around EVERY store in your country and ask them how many Wiis, PS3s etc. they have sold, be my guest!

What you have to remember is that these statistics companies do it for a living. If your barista can't make a good cup, complain. If enough people complain, he'll get the sack. If enough people complain about statistics (or stop buying them), the whole company would go tits up. So I guess they're pretty good!


Ah retro,
The stat you got, weren't from NPN were they? were did you get them from?

Umm, the stats I gave earlier in the thread?


Q1 2007 (taken from MCV but unsure what region):

Methinks it is the readers of said stats that need to brush up on their skills! ;-)

I took them (as previously said) from MCV, the UK industry magazine. Pretty much every games shop in the UK will read MCV. It has been around for a great many years, under a different title before. They will be precisely the kind of people who buy statistics, so yes they may well have come from NPN if they weren't from GfK. If it is good enough for MCV (and I know some people who work there), it's good enough for me ;-)

[wildcat]

Sounds good retro,

Wiki buys there stats from NPN, did you notice there statement in the link I provided in my post? I consider Wiki a pretty good place to get infor but at times I still cross reference though .

Oh by the way retro,

Employers these days don't care too much about how many complains they get from customers. what they care about is weather there sales volume goes down. So if enough customer boycott a business than they might see the light, but my experiance has been even some of these business owners and managers are pretty dum! meaning they don't even know or care about whats going on till its too late. I believe thats why alot of businesses go out of business and the owners don't even know what happen, I have seen it time and again.:shrug:


grahf,

Welcome! I read your post too! true, true!

[Eviltaco64]

Honestly I think the Playstation 3 is the best console of this generation. It just does a lot more, and the game library has been getting much better as well. It's been nothing but uphill for the console, and all Sony needs to do now is cut the price down, which I heard they're doing sometime in Spring 2009.

I dislike the Xbox 360. I sent mine into Microsoft twice before finally fixing it myself, and now that I've repaired it, the fans are even louder! Not to mention the RRoD wasn't my only problem. My first 360 stopped outputting video because that one chip near the fans came loose or some shit, and it would've cost me $98 for them to fix it since my consoles full non-RRoD warranty expired two weeks prior.

The Wii is a good console, but it's overrated and underpowered. I especially hate it when people call the Wii innovative for the motion sensing controls. It's like those controls make up for the fact that it's an enhanced Gamecube that doesn't even have DVD playback (without homebrew, of course), something that Playstation 2 did in 2000.

Right now though, I'm planning on building up more of a Saturn, Sega CD, and 32X collection. I still need to get a Saturn, and I will be getting one soon. Add a 4M Action Replay cart and a modchip (and maybe even that MPEG decoder) and you've got yourself a beast of a 32-bit console! :icon_bigg

[Midwinter]

The PS3 feels too western for my taste. Obviously living in the states I can only base this off of feelings because I know the XBOX sells about as well as a bag of horse testicles in Japan. The XBOX feels like a Japanese console and has some cool RPGs and quirky games that I can't seem to find in the limited PS3 library.

I wasn't a huge fan of the original XBOX - I liked that they brought network gaming even more mainstream than the Dreamcast did for me, but the library was abysmal in my taste. The 360 feels like an ancestor to the Sega hardware line up. It made me start having fun again when I was playing games with achievements and having friends online. Just the whole interface and everything won me over. I get the same feeling with the Wii even though it is Gamecube's baby boy.

The PS3 I bought on release day (just like every console that comes out) and I watched Blu-Ray movies on it for the next few months. Scratch that - the next few years. That's right I think I've put a couple games in the slot and they were mostly first generation titles using backwards compatibility. Don't get me started on Home. I really wanted to love it.... :love: But ---- :shrug: it did nothing for me.

As long as the console does good in Japan though - it will continue to live on in all countries. I guess it needs a few more good selling releases like White Knight Chronicles and that could help it out.

[retro]

Does anyone else feel that comparing the PS3 to the 360 is like comparing dog shit to horse shit?

:lol:


When I was growing up, everything was "a Nintendo" even my Sega Genesis was haha....

Someone here has grown up?? We all play video games still, didn't think any of us had! ;-) lol


Wiki buys there stats from NPN, did you notice there statement in the link I provided in my post? I consider Wiki a pretty good place to get infor but at times I still cross reference though .

I assume you mean Wikipedia - wiki is a generic term meaning a user-editable site, basically. Wikipedia in itself is one huge user-created site. I don't know that any of the information is actually put on there by the company who owns it, let alone them buying stats. So I'd imagine that the stats on Wikipedia are provided by someone who either does subscribe, or read it in a magazine. In short, trusting Wikipedia is just like trusting opinion on this very board - there are some people who know what they're talking about, but you still have to take it with a pinch of salt ;-)

Which statement did you mean?

That link about console wars has citations for the sources of the data, 26-30. If you look at them, it shows the sources as The Canadian Press via Yahoo!, GameDaily via AOL, GamesIndustry.biz, Eurogamer and Market for Home Computer and Video Games. THEY are the sources who have bought data from the likes of GfK and NPD.

[Barc0de]

Xbox 360? Plastic and cheap feeling? It's got a metal case..? I think it feels really solid, and no more 'cheap' feeling than any other games console.

The games library is intense on the 360- a huge selection of top titles that can be had for next to no money whatsoever. The controller is a dream- the most comfy controller ever, next to the Gamecube. The whole 360 experience is fantastic, and as a new owner, I have been impressed through and through.

The PS3 strikes me as having few exclusives worth my attention, and the controller is nearly exactly the same as from 1996- it was a slapdash design then and its a slapdash design now.

I'd need someone to verify this, but I believe the PS3 can only display in 50hz on SDTVs which is a serious influencing factor on my purchase. Can anyone verify this?

However, there is no way - no way - the PS3 will 'die'. It may 'finish' in third, but its obviously going to have a huge cult following from those loyal to the Playstation brand, and, as mentioned, those who believe it is a quality, luxury item above the 360. I just hope Sony will learn from these mistakes and listen to the complaints of the people who know best, the gamers.

I can verify that although my multisystem TV supports SDTV, due to my PS3 being PAL games are displayed at 480p/50hz :(

[randyrandall]

I can verify that although my multisystem TV supports SDTV, due to my PS3 being PAL games are displayed at 480p/50hz :(

Ugh. I think I was just sick in my mouth a little bit.

[wildcat]

Well retro,

I did mean the site you mentioned, I just put it in short form, I guess.

Yes, either the site or a contributor did subscribe and provide data stright from NPN on the subject of console sales for Canada maybe other countries too.

Canada sales figures
Based on figures from the NPD Group (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NPD_Group), as of 1 August 2008 (2008 -08-01)<SUP class="plainlinks asof-tag update" style="DISPLAY: none">[update] (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Console_wars&action=edit)</SUP>:<SUP class=reference id=cite_ref-25>[26] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Console_wars#cite_note-25)</SUP>

Wii – 1,060,000
Xbox 360 – 870,000
PlayStation 3 – 520,000

As for the wiki site,

I will take there data at face value till proven different. I have found there information accurate and quite useful to me.

Others here don't like the site or are quite critical of the content on that site, but I'am not one of them.


So far its been great with them and there info! :dance:

[Evangelion-01]

I just bought a 360, i needed something to heat up the room as cold winter is cold, sony doesn't provide that to me.

[wildcat]

Evangelion-01,


Lol, if you live in Canada that would be a good ideal! :clap:

[Tenchi]

lol I think I should buy a xbox 360 too. Since we are getting no gas anymore from Ukraine it is getting soooooooooooooo cold in Austria :evil:

[Barc0de]

Ugh. I think I was just sick in my mouth a little bit.

sorry, it plays at the unorthodox (and made-up) resolution of 576p! My TV does 480p fine, but doesn't display 576p properly as to horizontal lines, resulting in a sort of "zoomed" image - ie the left and right of the real image seems to be wider than the actual TV's 4:3 frame.

I say made-up because EDTV is 480p (NTSC), there's no PAL standard equivalent really

[Martin]

Does anyone else feel that comparing the PS3 to the 360 is like comparing dog shit to horse shit?

In this vein... I'd rather play with my own shit (Dreamcast).

[Unorthodox]

PS3 death clock
<hr style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" size="1"> <!-- / icon and title --> <!-- message --> Anyone care to set a time?
At the way people keep posting here this thread will out live the PS3.

[ServiceGames]

That's because there is more creativity and replay value in this thread than the PS3 can muster and it's free of charge.

[retro]

At the way people keep posting here this thread will out live the PS3.

:thumbsup:


That's because there is more creativity and replay value in this thread than the PS3 can muster and it's free of charge.

:lol:

It is getting a bit tiring though - logging in and seeing this thread as the most recent. AGAIN!

[graciano1337]

It is getting a bit tiring though - logging in and seeing this thread as the most recent. AGAIN!

:lol:

this thread and GoH's "budding comic" thread are always near the top. i guess i'm not really helping the matter...

[PhreQuencYViii]

People like to just talk sometimes...no problem with that.

[Alchy]

People like to just talk sometimes...no problem with that.In general I think forums are too obsessed with keeping things on-topic. So long as the conversation is stimulating, what's the problem?

If this thread honestly makes it to the end of the PS3's life, though, I'd be kind of disappointed. I can't imagine that the talk of death would be interesting for all those years.

[wildcat]

The media perpetuates this thread by making stories like the recent london times story about massive layoffs.

When sony goes and states there coming out with a ps4 after charging adsorbent amounts for there ps3 consoles I wonder how many customer there going to have left after that. Than to compound matters software companies charge hefty amounts for the gaming software. It just gets to the point of being ridiculous.

[Jamtex]

I can verify that although my multisystem TV supports SDTV, due to my PS3 being PAL games are displayed at 480p/50hz :(
What fool would play PS3 games on a SDTV anyway? Like having a Ferrari and not going out of first gear.

[randyrandall]

Not everyone has an HDTV, as simple as. At least the 360, as far as I have seen, only supports PAL60 on SD.

[Alchy]

At least the 360, as far as I have seen, only supports PAL60 on SD.You can choose PAL50 or PAL60, but some games require 60Hz.

[mooseblaster]

Oh dear, I think somebody just wound the clock back up...

http://www.joystiq.com/2009/01/13/reuters-sony-may-post-1-1-billion-loss/

[Barc0de]

What fool would play PS3 games on a SDTV anyway? Like having a Ferrari and not going out of first gear.

the type that wants a PS3 in his living room but has no spare cash for a big-screen HDTV. I didn't know u thought so lowly of the poor:P

[oldengineer]

It is getting a bit tiring though - logging in and seeing this thread as the most recent. AGAIN!

TTT, bump, etc, etc

[alphagamer]

one of the biggest problems of the ps3 is, besides the high price, that it is not hacked yet.

the wii and 360 are hackable... and in the lead... coincidence? i think not!

[Alchy]

one of the biggest problems of the ps3 is, besides the high price, that it is not hacked yet.

the wii and 360 are hackable... and in the lead... coincidence? i think not!I hope you're not serious. That isn't a main factor in sales performance, not by a long shot.

[PhreQuencYViii]

360 is hackable? For non pirate reasons like the old Xbox?

[Barc0de]

360 is hackable? For non pirate reasons like the old Xbox?

well if someone has the signatures, which i doubt.

[graciano1337]

Oh dear, I think somebody just wound the clock back up...

http://www.joystiq.com/2009/01/13/reuters-sony-may-post-1-1-billion-loss/
good news! bring on the price drop i say! they should drop the price to coincide with Killzone's release.

[randyrandall]

Cheers for the clarification Alchy. I should have said that most games only support PAL60..

[wildcat]

alphagamer,

I wondering if sony had lower the price of there ps3 console to the same as the 360 pro could they have avoid lay off?

December 10, 2008 London Times

Sony is to cut more than 16,000 permanent and part-time jobs from its worldwide electronics division and will raise prices for its products in the face of dwindling consumer spending.
The draconian restructuring, which will also involve Sony shedding an unspecified number of “unprofitable or noncore” divisions from its sprawling portfolio, is the biggest of its sort announced in Asia since the global financial crisis took hold.
However, it is expected to set the tone for similar moves by Sony’s domestic and regional rivals.
Citing an “acute downturn in the economic climate”, Sony acknowledged that it may also be forced to make equivalent cost cuts from its video games and movie businesses. It said that the situation was “under simultaneous review” and that an announcement would be made early next year.

Sony made some really dum moves, like announcing there coming out with a ps4 and then lowering the price of the ps3.

That move above really gaves me and other consumers alot of confidence to run out and buy a sony console. :banghead:
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[yuckymucky]

360 is hackable? For non pirate reasons like the old Xbox?

Just for pirate reasons..or the so called "backup".

I have a 60GB PS3 and while it doesn't get played as much as I would like it does get a decent amount of use. I think that it is an awesome system, however it is expensive for most people right now.

[wildcat]

Here is better news for all you sony hardcore fans!

Sony to slash $100 from the PlayStation 3 this spring


With the Nintendo Wii well out of sight and Microsoft claiming the Xbox 360 has increased its unit lead over the PlayStation 3 to a whopping eight million, Sony’s best hope for hauling back the competition lies in reducing the console’s persistently high pricing.
If recent comments by Wedbush Morgan videogame analyst Michael Pachter are anything to go by, a potentially substantial PlayStation 3 price drop could be implemented by Sony Corp. this coming April.
According to Pachter, who’s known for mixed accuracy when it comes to his industry predictions, Sony will reduce the price of its 80GB powerhouse console from $399 USD to $299 USD in the weeks directly preceding this year’s E3 conference in California.
Pachter’s claim comes after American software titan Microsoft further distanced its Xbox 360 from the PlayStation 3 by dropping the price of its basic Xbox 360 to just $199 USD in September of 2008 – making it the best value console of the current generation and even undercutting the über popular Wii.
While a $299 USD price tag attached to the 80GB PlayStation 3 is likely to reinvigorate interest in the Blu-ray-equipped console, Pachter also believes that Microsoft will respond to Sony’s action by hacking even more dollars off its Xbox 360 Pro model (a.k.a. Premium).
If Pachter’s predictions carry any weight, then prospective Xbox 360 buyers can expect a further drop of $50 USD on the Pro model this coming May (bringing it to $249 USD) as Microsoft and Sony continue to trade blows while market leader Nintendo sits back and watches on in quiet amusement.
In terms of a possible price reduction to the hot-selling Wii, Pachter offers than unfailing consumer demand for the innovative motion-sensing console is likely to see its retail tag left unchanged – although he does offer Christmas 2009 as a tentative possibility.

[Alchy]

According to Pachter, who’s known for mixed accuracy when it comes to his industry predictionsI'll wait until Sony announce it before raising a toast to their generosity. Or at least, some source other than an unknown analyst.

[graciano1337]

it'd definitely be more willing to pick up a PS3 if they dropped it $100. that would be fantastic!

[Barc0de]

it'd definitely be more willing to pick up a PS3 if they dropped it $100. that would be fantastic!

I ll slap you:Girl:

[PhreQuencYViii]

Give me BC!

[Evangelion-01]

Give me BC!yeah, i'd buy one for 300 with bc, even if its just emulated mmm pussy....

[karsten]

299? i guess they would sell it to me

[graciano1337]

I ll slap you:Girl:

not too soft... :033:

[wildcat]

Alchy,


I don't blame you for waiting, I would too, hehehe!


Sony should have lower the ps3 down to at least $350 to compete with the xbox and hold a better market position.

[cahaz]

Even in today's economy, the ps3 won't die, it is ridiculous to claim such thing. The worst it could do is having a fate similar to the original xbox. Sony have too much ressources on all sides to drop the thing.

[Yakumo]

and will raise prices for its products in the face of dwindling consumer spending. Makes sense. Your products aren't selling so jack up the price. Yeah, that will get the public flooding in flocks to buy stuff they couldn't afford in the first place :rolleyes:

I'm sure there must be a logical reason for upping prices but apart from Sony trying to make money I can't see any from a consumers point of view.

Yakumo

[ServiceGames]

One might raise prices due to inflation..

The PS3 may not die anytime soon, but I strongly believe it possible that their goal will become minimalization of loss rather than 'cash machine' like previous iterations of the Playstation brand.

[wildcat]

Even in today's economy, the ps3 won't die, it is ridiculous to claim such thing. The worst it could do is having a fate similar to the original xbox. Sony have too much ressources on all sides to drop the thing.


Well so far your right,


I thought sony might go under cause of the way there handling there business.

[retro]

I thought sony might go under cause of the way there handling there business.

Umm, what? Are you basing that on just one product??

Sony is one of the largest electronics companies in the World. They are still a leading manufacturer for televisions, DVD players, projectors, Hi-Fis, mobile phones, ebook readers, laptops, desktop computers, cameras, camcorders, portable entertainment units (Walkman), headphones, car stereos, the Blu ray format... and I'm sure I must have left something out. That's just consumer products, too - they also do professional video equipment such as broadcast cameras, monitors, VTRs, editing systems etc.

They aren't going to go bust due to one product flopping. Which it isn't, anyway.

[Barc0de]

He means the Sony Computer Entertainment (or whatever its called) subsidiary I think

[A. Snow]

As long as Sony doesn't rehire Bernie Stolar I'd say the PS3 is safe for the time being.

[drakon]

well, gives you an excuse to buy a blu-ray player. How well are blu-rays welling in comparison to dvds? I go to my local blockbuster video and half the store is blu-ray now. I mean it's not the right reason to pick up a gaming system but I guess it can keep them afloat.

[Alchy]

well, gives you an excuse to buy a blu-ray player. How well are blu-rays welling in comparison to dvds? I go to my local blockbuster video and half the store is blu-ray now. I mean it's not the right reason to pick up a gaming system but I guess it can keep them afloat.Over here it's not more than 5% of the floor space.

[Christer-swe]

Over here it's not more than 5% of the floor space.
I second that. 5% of the floor space over here aswell. Tops.

[wildcat]

Well retro,

Sonys made alot of mistake in different divsion of there business.

1. There over price on everything they sell

2. There marketing strategies sucked on the psp

3. Sonys very proprietary.

3. There struggling to sell there Blue Ray


How long can they be mis-managed?


All the above mistakes cost alot money.

I ask you 2 questions retro can it get any worst?

Sooner or later they will get out or go down.


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[Barc0de]

Sony is very proprietary? try nintendo for a change! Sony has been the most open firm this generation, starting at the development tools and sharing policy down to having linux right off the bat on the ps3!

[Alchy]

I think he means in terms of their media formats (epitomised by their portable music player that didn't play MP3s), but yeah, in terms of PS3 they've been surprisingly open with it. Region restrictions especially.

[wildcat]

Well I would imagine that all the consoles are proprietary.

Meaning you have to deal with the company that you bought the console from for accessories or add-on hardware.

I wouldn't try and compare the Wii with the 360 or Sony's gaming console cause, I don't consider the Wii a fps machine and I don't know much if anything about the Wii except its for real young kids thats why I don't have a Will. I'am only a fps player.

[Barc0de]

isn't that a bit shallow though? I mean all of us prefer some genre (hate that word) but every once in a while other well executed titles are enjoyable too, provided we give them a chance.

[Alchy]

I'am only a fps player.I'd have to agree with Barcode, that's kind of depressing. A bit like only listening to one type of music or only watching one genre of film.

[wildcat]

True for some of you hardcore types,

I'am suppose to already have the 360 & the ps3 but do to some unforseen circumstances I have decided to hold off.

The other thing is that I stick with 1 game for a very long time, sometimes even years. You couldn't talk me into changing to a new game even if you tried your hardest.

I notice on this forum I'am really,really, really, small potato when it comes to collections or gaming.

I don't think I could store any were near some of the collections I see here on this forum. One reason why is I travel alot and when I do. I get rid of everything, so as to keep storage cost as far down as I can.

I'am on the move alot these days and have been for the last 4yrs , ie all over the country and soon to be beyond ie outside the country.

[jccochez]

well, i hope sony will do it better for PS4.

And I also hope it will continue to be region free too !!!
I like the fact that sony isn't the first one anymore. They were just too arrogant and all.

I don't want them to be die, however. Even if I prefer 360 for this generation, I think that they may still give something to the industry.

Sony and Microsoft may be able to stop nintendo and its casual wave. Hopefully...

[wildcat]

Well heres another quote from the president of sony,

Sony Computer Entertainment president Ken Kutaragi was not ambivalent about the pricing of the console -- he kept saying it was a premium machine, sold at a premium price. Want a PS3? Work a little harder!
http://static.seekingalpha.com/wp-content/seekingalpha/images/ps3idea.jpg"Our ideal," Kutaragi said, "is for consumers to think to themselves, 'OK, I'll work more hours and buy it.' We want people to feel that they want it, no matter what."



But the consumer reaction was swift -- and harsh. Even the Official Playstation Magazine had a bold cover headline that asked, "Is It Worth $600?"

In June, a month after Sony announced its price points for the PS3, analysts at Merrill Lynch estimated Sony would lose more than $1 billion in the console's first year of existence. By comparison, Sony lost only $458 million during the first year the PS2 was available. The company followed that with two strong years of profit -- $759 million in Year 2 and $1.3 billion in Year 3.

Since sony already betrayed there customers on the ps3 why would anyone want to buy a ps4.

Also if you had gotten into that cell research and found out they dump that, than what? :crying:

[Alchy]

Well heres another quote from the president of sony,

Sony Computer Entertainment president Ken Kutaragi was not ambivalent about the pricing of the console -- he kept saying it was a premium machine, sold at a premium price. Want a PS3? Work a little harder!
http://static.seekingalpha.com/wp-content/seekingalpha/images/ps3idea.jpg"Our ideal," Kutaragi said, "is for consumers to think to themselves, 'OK, I'll work more hours and buy it.' We want people to feel that they want it, no matter what."



But the consumer reaction was swift -- and harsh. Even the Official Playstation Magazine had a bold cover headline that asked, "Is It Worth $600?"

In June, a month after Sony announced its price points for the PS3, analysts at Merrill Lynch estimated Sony would lose more than $1 billion in the console's first year of existence. By comparison, Sony lost only $458 million during the first year the PS2 was available. The company followed that with two strong years of profit -- $759 million in Year 2 and $1.3 billion in Year 3.You didn't post where you quoted this from, but wherever it was, it's ancient and irrelevant. PS3's no longer cost $600.

[Christer-swe]

I think he means in terms of their media formats (epitomised by their portable music player that didn't play MP3s), but yeah, in terms of PS3 they've been surprisingly open with it. Region restrictions especially.

What about Blu-Ray? They are one of the biggest founders of the Blu-Ray format.

[wildcat]

Well Christer-swe,

Sony drop there price on there Blu-ray machine quite bit which I think will help, but there movies are as expensive as hell.


So there question is can they get the public to follow?


Would you pay $15 to $25, bucks for a movie?

[alphagamer]

Well Christer-swe,

Sony drop there price on there Blu-ray machine quite bit which I think will help, but there movies are as expensive as hell.


So there question is can they get the public to follow?


Would you pay $15 to $25, bucks for a movie?

here in good old europe bluray movies cost $35+

[graciano1337]

You didn't post where you quoted this from, but wherever it was, it's ancient and irrelevant. PS3's no longer cost $600.

yeah, i'm thinking that quote/article is from before the PS3's launch...

[Unorthodox]

Since sony already betrayed there customers on the ps3 why would anyone want to buy a ps4.

Wha?

Since when have Sony "betrayed" any of their customers by selling a console they themselves lose money on per unit?

[Taucias]

April will see a $300 PS3.

[Christer-swe]

Well Christer-swe,

Sony drop there price on there Blu-ray machine quite bit which I think will help, but there movies are as expensive as hell.


So there question is can they get the public to follow?


Would you pay $15 to $25, bucks for a movie?

Like alphagamer said, here BD movies costs $35+, but I wasn't referring to that. Someone mentioned that Sony have dropped region restrictions this generation, which is true when it comes to games but BD movies are still region locked, unlike HD-DVD which Microsoft backed for some time.

[sequent_blender]

Although all Blu-Ray discs say that they're region locked, most of them (60 to 70% of them) aren't. I have a PAL PS3 that plays some Japanese and US Blu-Ray discs, in spite of what it says on the packaging.

There's a site here (http://bluray.liesinc.net/) that lists whether BD movies are region free or not, so you may well be able to get the movie you want cheaper overseas....

Dave.

[alphagamer]

Although all Blu-Ray discs say that they're region locked, most of them (60 to 70% of them) aren't. I have a PAL PS3 that plays some Japanese and US Blu-Ray discs, in spite of what it says on the packaging.

There's a site here (http://bluray.liesinc.net/) that lists whether BD movies are region free or not, so you may well be able to get the movie you want cheaper overseas....

Dave.

you are my hero (for today at least!)

thanks!

[wildcat]

Wha?

Since when have Sony "betrayed" any of their customers by selling a console they themselves lose money on per unit?


Unorthodox,

If there losing money, its cause of sony's stupidity!

Sony screwed up so bad they can't compete againest Microsoft. Look at there rather shallow selection of games. Do you want to buy a sony console for $519 without tax, without being able to buy alot of games for it? What purpose would tha serve? If that isn't being betrayed what is? and $519 is todays price without tax. Thats the least expensive sony console, Good Luck!

Here's what sony thinks,

Sony Computer Entertainment president Ken Kutaragi was not ambivalent about the pricing of the console -- he kept saying it was a premium machine, sold at a premium price. Want a PS3? Work a little harder!
http://static.seekingalpha.com/wp-content/seekingalpha/images/ps3idea.jpg"Our ideal," Kutaragi said, "is for consumers to think to themselves, 'OK, I'll work more hours and buy it.' We want people to feel that they want it, no matter what."


You know what I'd say to this president?

Come back to reality Bozo!

[Eviltaco64]

$519? You can get them anywhere for $350 used (save the premium models, which are a little more expensive), or $400 new.

It's not 2006 anymore.

[Alchy]

Uand $519 is todays price without tax. Thats the least expensive sony console, Good Luck!You really need to do most basic of research before you post.
http://www.amazon.com/PlayStation-3-80GB/dp/B001COU9I6/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1232392461&sr=8-1
There's a brand new PS3 for $400 after tax. I already told you the following was ancient, fuck knows why you've posted it a second time:


Sony Computer Entertainment president Ken Kutaragi was not ambivalent about the pricing of the console -- he kept saying it was a premium machine, sold at a premium price. Want a PS3? Work a little harder!
http://static.seekingalpha.com/wp-content/seekingalpha/images/ps3idea.jpg"Our ideal," Kutaragi said, "is for consumers to think to themselves, 'OK, I'll work more hours and buy it.' We want people to feel that they want it, no matter what."

You could easily save yourself from looking like an idiot by listening to people, you know.